Saunders, Real Estate, Hamptons

44 Comments by Holly 64.5

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Tuckahoe School Files Suit Against Town For Denying FOIL Request For Golf Course Revenues

"More wasted money to pay a law firm for nonsense". You care to elaborate on that big shot? You want to investigate a measly $30k raise or $90k errantly spent years ago but to you it doesn't seems like a good investment to spend a few thousand in an effort to recoup $2,000,000 per year!? This is one of the few things the board has done right and of course, you were the first one to comment on the ''craziness at your expense''. You're entitled to your own opinion, but not your own facts." Dec 17, 14 12:33 PM

It's actually being taxed, just in a different way. The golf courses which make up most of the most prime real estate and 13% of the district pay on the average about $795/acre in taxes. The Tuckahoe homeowner is paying roughly $2300/acre. These clubs in Tuckahoe are comprised of the most elite in the sport and some of the most expensive in the nation to join. The issue here is that these clubs cannot be compelled, to date, to expose what they make. The bankers, tax attorneys and titans of industry that make up their boards are allowed to be their own assessors. If you are capable of separating your feelings about the school district and the members of the district's board, the inequity here should be as plain as day." Dec 17, 14 1:42 PM

The same people that are cooking the books at the clubs in order to pay the least amount of local taxes are the same people running a non profit Association in Southampton that is only allowed to keep it's tax favored status because it doesn't engage in lobbying in civic matters. Imagine that." Dec 18, 14 5:38 AM

Are you serious? You asked a question that indicated that you were spectacularly misinformed and continue to come to a judgmental conclusion as if it's true. The right to purchase the house was in the homeowner's will. The BOE at the time put it up for a vote and the district voted to purchase the house. The premise was that there is all land bordering the school was private and this might be the only opportunity to expand the school grounds for eons. You can be against a school, it's district, the families that send their kids their, the buses, but for the sake of your own sense of ethics and personal intellectual dignity - spend a few minutes seeking out the factual information contained in the archives of this very site. " Dec 19, 14 6:48 AM

Wow. Just wow. First, some of my best work was removed and now this post. My motherly instinct is taking over. I can't watch anymore. Son, nobody is coming after your money, you will be ok in your retirement and everything is going to work out for you. A school district can't hurt anyone and you have nothing to fear. Your taxes are going to go up this year, but not because of anything having to do with the land between Hampton Bays and Southampton commonly referred to as Tuckahoe. It's really just land, some roads, houses - well, you've been there before. Good luck and hope you feel better soon." Dec 19, 14 7:03 AM

I'm not sure where to start with your post but here it goes. Private golf clubs are in the business of making a profit, however, profit and income are two different things. The tax is levied on the income, not on improvements to the property. A non-material amount of low skill cheap labor is employed. If there were homes on the property the amount of good purchased to run the homes would far outweigh the small amount of last minute resources that are picked up locally as opposed to bulk delivery. If the land were developed and taxed at the same rate the golf courses were taxed at, they school would receive approximately 6x the income per acre as they currently get from the golf courses. " Dec 19, 14 1:06 PM

You just mentioned Shirley Links in an article about Southampton. You care to explain the relevance? If you think $2,000,000/year is not going to go a heckuva long way towards bailing the district out you're lacking ability to think straight." Dec 19, 14 4:24 PM

It really doesn't matter if they are profitable or not. They are taxed on their income. Not profit. I would be fine with the golf clubs being their own assessors free from scrutiny if the homeowners and businesses of Tuckahoe are provided with the same luxury." Dec 19, 14 4:27 PM

Fine. We will add you to the list that think it's ok for wealthy land owners to assess themselves free from scrutiny while the homeowners and businesses are forced to be taxed in a totally different manner, resulting in a higher level of taxation under the constant threat of persecution." Dec 19, 14 4:30 PM

Can you support your contention that Tuckahoe has mismanaged their budget?" Dec 19, 14 10:46 PM

The driving range already is being taxed at a higher per acre rate. If he doesn't pay his taxes correctly, he's looking at fines, penalties and potentially jail time. The golf club pays less, assesses itself and is free from scrutiny. Regardless of anything that you want to say or toss out there to muddy up the waters, this is the fact. All the other fluff is just that fluff. The school should be commended for demanding performance under the freedom of information act. Someday it might be you requesting information to which you are entitled. Lucky there are people fighting for your right to what should be public information. " Dec 20, 14 1:36 PM

Spare us. The question is not why do you have to pay for anyone else's kids to go to school. You don't like federal immigration law nor are you happy about the system of municipal taxation in this country. You want to pay every teacher the same and you would no sooner appoint yourself all knowing supreme leader of the land. Sounds like you need to move to Russia. There has never been this much whining about a singular topic on this website in as long as I can remember. It's pretty amazing, actually, that you can unhinge your white knuckles from your coins long enough to repeat some paranoid mantra about people coming for your money and geniuses plotting to brainwash the people of Tuckahoe. Everybody knows the tax assessor by the way, she's a staple at the golf clubs." Dec 20, 14 1:42 PM

Lamm's assessment and tax levy is public and can be found on the Southampton Town tax roll section of the website. Every residential and commercial address in both Southampton and Tuckahoe school districts are available online. Only the golf clubs' are not. This even goes for the chef who is no doubt busy cooking up his next plate of boloney. Nobody is looking for anyone's tax return. " Dec 20, 14 1:46 PM

No. My reference to the tax assessor is in direct response to the chef's comment above. But, you do raise a very good point. Your reference touches upon the concept of ''conflict of interest''. Have you ever before heard of a court case where a group was given the luxury of self-assessment without the responsibility of proving their numbers? It should be perplexing to most that in tandem to that right the methodology of their assessment and associated tax levy resulted in a huge reduction of taxes to municipalities operating in the red. It's probably a coincidence that the people who give the most to the politicians that appoint the judges belong to the golf clubs given the special dispensations. " Dec 21, 14 7:23 AM

In a perfect world we would all be allowed to self assess our properties and pay reduced taxes without anyone being able to call us on it. The Board of Education works for the taxpayers in that district. Keeping the golf courses honest, so to speak, is the responsible thing to do on behalf of their constituents. If the golf clubs are on the up-and-up - then nobody should be so uptight. This will end quickly if the court deems it without merit. Your concern for your pal chef is admirable but that man is spreading more misinformation than pravda on a good day." Dec 21, 14 7:41 AM

It is ironic that someone who has named themselves bigfresh is still parroting such a stale message, complete with caps and exclamation points. Do you have the courage to explain how your concept is even relevant? Are you under the paranoid impression that residents of Tuckahoe have suddenly woken up to realize where they live and have been surprised by their tax rate? It sure sounds that way, and on top if it, you sound afraid that Tuckahoe families are looking to steal your money? This, under an article about how the Tuckahoe BOE is taking steps to avoid a merger. " Dec 21, 14 12:08 PM

I checked several of your past posts and you have suggested that Tuckahoe families moved to Tuckahoe by choice and should deal with the costs associated with living there. How you reconcile that with the fact that you chose to send your kids to public school knowing that you were going to have to pay for that and for property taxes, the majority of which go to the public school?! Your revelation tells every reader of this article all they need to know about you. You resent having to pay property taxes while willingly sending your kids to a private school with over crowded classes. Check mate." Dec 21, 14 12:59 PM

He is upset that he has to pay property taxes while sending his children to a private school. He willingly bought a home in Southampton knowing full well what the property taxes were and what the public schools were like and now he is all mad that he has to pay property taxes. Either way, I think we will have to wait until after midnight. He has made his 2 comments today and appears to set his alarm to get the next comment up as soon as possible after the clock strikes 12 midnight. He has some nerve to suggest that people moved to Tuckahoe willingly and should pay the cost - while admitting that he doesn't like paying property taxes and private school tuition - both of which he is doing willingly. It would be interesting to know what his primary reason for not utilizing the public schools was." Dec 21, 14 1:09 PM

Male chauvinism, check. Reference to progressive liberals, check. union reference, check. reference to insolvent financial system, check. Ridiculous pensions, check. Hyperbolic lecturing, check. Nonsensical yet dramatic conclusion, check. I think we are really starting to get to the bottom of what is eating you chef. " Dec 21, 14 2:30 PM

Homophobic, check. Anti first amendment, check. And your list goes on. You bought a house because the taxes were low and proceeded to increase them by sending your kids to private school. The school is fine but your kids could potentially learn about gay people. You leave it up to your children's school to instill the important principles of work ethic and discipline. If it weren't for the fact that our communication was on the internet, I would swear I was communicating with a plantation owner in the 1800s." Dec 21, 14 7:01 PM

Probably the smartest thing you could have done was to appoint yourself moron eliminator. Will help keep you around longer." Dec 21, 14 7:43 PM

Completely agree. If you see anyone doing that, please let me know." Dec 21, 14 7:48 PM

While you're strolling down the fairway
Showing no remorse
Glowing from the poisons
They've sprayed on your golf course
While you're busy sinking birdies
And keeping your scorecard
The devil's been busy in your back yard

Steaming down the highway
With your trucks of toxic waste
Where you gonna hide it
In the outer space?
You don't know what you're doing
Or what you have to guard
The devil's been busy in your back yard

Sometimes you think you're crazy
But you know you're only mad
Sometimes you're better off not knowing
How much you've been had" Dec 22, 14 6:38 AM

I'm still reeling from the fact that chef chose OLH to better protect them from hearing about homosexuality. ie " Southampton School is fine, but I don't like the politics, and political correctness they teach in public school. Kids in 5th grade don't need to know two men, or two woman can have a baby"" Dec 22, 14 6:41 AM

Did you ever think you would have to take such a tortured route as to support the IRS in order to take a dig at the board of a school that is not even in your own district? Taxes hurt investments, they are not investments themselves? On another topic, it seems fitting that April1 is the name you have given yourself. It's almost like the holiday on April 1 was made just for you!" Dec 22, 14 12:28 PM

It's time to consolidate schools as soon as possible. We don't need to spend hundreds of thousands to figure out Tuckahoe needs to be merged with Southampton. We can get rid of a couple greedy administrators and duplicate expenses at Tuckahoe that will save millions. The education situation will become even worse in the future. The federal govt will be giving less to states, and the state will have less money to fund with. This country needs to take it Obama medicine of cuts, and education is one of the things being cut. The education in this state is going down hill and the idiots on the East End elect the same stooges Bishop, Thiele, and Lavalle. When will we learn nothing is for free, and twenty Hispanic kids is one house will ruin all the Islands school districts. " Nov 30, 12 9:13 PM" Dec 22, 14 1:09 PM

Whoa. What? You actually thought that Southampton District would take over a new school, add 300+ more children, dozens more teachers and the costs associated with their programs and that costs would go down with those additions? See, this is what happens when you just spout things without thinking them through. You were as big a proponent FOR a merger as you now are AGAINST a merger. I believe the word is feeble.

And I am no teacher, but if I were, I would proudly admit to such an honorable profession. I respect teachers a great deal. " Dec 22, 14 3:58 PM

Perfect, even more the reason to examine how organizations that make no money were allowed to change their tax assessment from the value of their property to the amount of money they make. Your clarifications have made this issue even more suspect and thus in need of further scrutiny. I support the Tuckahoe Board of Education in this move to force disclosure under the freedom of information act. Do you support that move or not, that it what the article is about." Dec 23, 14 5:45 AM

Honestly, this is all fluff and has no bearing on the article or its subject but thank you for that clarification. If Mother Theresa herself was the Tax Assessor I would support the Tuckahoe BOE looking into a decision that allows entities who apparently make no money be taxed on how much money they make. Have you ever in your life heard of such a luxury being granted to a such a narrow sector of the population? I'm not a conspiracy theorist but any thinking person would want to know how the largest political contributors were able to get away with such a sham. If you trust that the court did such a fabulous and ethical job on that decision you will trust the courts to be as ethical and upstanding in their review of this litigation. " Dec 23, 14 5:52 AM

Chief, why don't we stand back and that this time at the end of the year to reflect on why people might hold a particular opinion of you that is less than what you may think of yourself. Shall we?

"The 130k a year patrolman couldn't stop the fight? What about the 250k a year chief? He didn't learn crowd control at one of those village paid for FBI camps? Abolish the village dept get the state police here who are better trained, and more experienced in this type of situation"

Guest Chef Program Takes Root In Hampton Bays
"What's next limo rides to school?" Nov 23, 11 6:00 PM

"The problem is there is no war on drugs and never has been. Do you think if the US military was on the Mexican border there would be a drug problem? Alcohol is legal and it is an epidemic in our society. Drugs are illegal only in theory in the US no one has problems getting drugs in this country. This country is becoming a weak society if we can't abide by a law change it. If you don't like your religion change it. How about doing things that are hard and not the easy way out. Put this punk in jail not in rehab if he was selling drugs. Hes a disease on society and an embarrassment to his family if hes guilty. " Apr 29, 12 8:01 PM

New York State Assembly Approves Law To Help Immigrant Students Get College Scholarships
"COSTS TAXPAYERS NOTHING? You people that think donations to a non profit cost the people nothing are kidding yourselves. The money comes from the rich who avoid taxes by giving money to non profits like this.Why do you think Mitt Romney pays less than 20% taxes and you working poor pay more than 40%! A nearly 15 trillion dollar govt debt is almost entirely from loop holes like this garbage. People are sheep in this country and believe anything" May 11, 12 10:09 PM

"Time to get rid of the Trustees we have the DEC and a bunch of other govt bureaus to do their job. What Judge ever enforced the Dongan Patent to begin with? It was a document made before this country was even settled by the King Of England. How could it even be legal it wasn't even made by an American Governing body. How much do the trustees pay on legal fees to defend all of their lawsuits? I think they infringe on peoples property rights, and often blame property owners for pollution. Time to save some money and dump them." May 21, 12 9:33 PM

"Eight cops a weekend stationed at the Boardy Barn at over 100k a year does that bother you?
But anyway I think it's clear that most in the Hampton Bays civic assoc are a bunch of old biddies against business. They dont like the canal redevelopment at the cpi and Tide Runners. They don't like any type of investment in business period. They even went as far to have a moratorium on commercial projects. Have they looked around, because Hampton Bays is turning into a dump with every other house overcrowded, one of the worst school districst on Long Island, and main St looking like little Havana." chief1, southampton

"Conrad is the x chief of Southampton what do you expect him to do in a situation involving a cop? I can't wait till these municipalities file bankruptcy and stop paying these lazy pension collectors" chief1, southampton

"Maertz And Fleming Hold First Debate In Southampton
Wait she made the Flanders farmer market at least three people go there. Her answer to economic stimulus in Flanders maybe she didn't notice there are no farms in Flanders"

"Can you imagine what a great country this would be if Parents. teachers, and students were this passionate about learning, morals, and ethics?"

"This idiot bishop is grasping for straws. Is it a coincidence when they announce this during election season? He acts as if its his money he used to have the inlet dredged. Hundreds of millions in tourism dollars rely on the inlet wether he is in congress or not it will be done. The fact remains he is the poster boy of whats wrong with Washington." chief1, southampton

UPDATE: Officials Discuss Plans For Southampton Hospital, Stony Brook Alliance, Plans For New Hospital
"The comment of bringing home the bacon is what is wrong with this country. Each community in this country will have too fend for itself in the future. We are out of money, and if you think Stony Brook wasting 30 million on a defunct project like Southampton was beneficial your lying too yourself. " chief1, southampton

"I don't live in Sagaponack, but I do own property in the village that Stalin would be proud of. This is an example of how stupid citizens worry about signs and not about problems like federal deficits, wars, and unemployment. The old biddys at the village boards should go back to knitting and not interfering with peoples constututional rights. I think the day is coming when some rich family will sue the village into oblivion over the loss of their property rights" Oct 11, 12 12:10 AM

Sandy Hook Tragedy Is Felt At East End Schools
"409 people killed by guns since the Newtown shooting. Meanwhile over 100k fetuses aborted and thrown in a dumpster. What a sick society we have become", chief1, southampton

House Of Representatives OKs $50 Billion Sandy Aid Bill; Will Go To U.S. Senate
"George Carlin the comedian drug addict is where you got your political views from?" chief1, southampton

Town Board Rejects First Draft Of Canoe Place Inn Report
"This country was built because a King said no land rights. Who the hell are you to say these people have no rights on their land to build a condo? Buy the land and condemn it if you would like it that way. Don't punish succes or this country will continue its path to a welfare state. And for Gods sake stop copying pages off the web and posting them. Oh I forgot your not very bright." Jan 29, 13 7:29 PM

Casino Development Company Cuts Off Payments To Shinnecock Tribe
"Please step off your moral politically high horse. As usual you have no idea what anyone is talking about due to your pea sized brain. The bottom line of what I said was the Southampton community has always been supportive of the Shinnecocks. I just don't like the term White man as a derogatory phrase. No one is questioning the bad treatment some Native Americans received. I find offense in being White and being lumped into a group that did something decades ago or even centuries ago. If I lumped Asians, Blacks, or Latinos into a stereotype I would be thrown off this board. So zip it" chief1, southampton.

"I don't care what happens at home with a kid. When he is on a sports team it is a priviledge, and the coach should ram that into every single players brain. The coach making the comment that they are being picked on is simply outrageous. Maybe the coach has a problem with authority?
Sure you can pick out the kids that have bad home lives, but dedication to sports is suppose to help change that. Southampton is starting to get a reputation of being a bunch of bullies. " chief1, southampton, Feb 11, 13 3:23 PM

LaValle Calls For School Property Tax Cap For Seniors
"I'm all for helping seniors. Unfortunately we have illegals paying no taxes, people on welfare not paying taxes, low income on the star program. Who the heck is going to pay the school taxes? Struggling middle class taxpayers who are barely making it? Mr Thiele, and Mr Lavalle have to protect everyone thats why they are in office. This is a ridiculous proposal." Feb 13, 13 9:16 PM" Dec 23, 14 1:22 PM

Gee, how disappointing. I didn't whine when you called me an idiot, in fact I ''liked' your comment. It was funny. One lil old lady like me runs interference after you've been hog wild all over this issue for 12+ months and this is how you waste your second and last post until after midnight tonight? Looks like when the going gets tough you and April jump into each other's arms. I'm sorry you feel so bullied. If you ever feel like you are going to take your anger about "schools wanting more and giving less" to the next level, please stop, think and make a phone call. Same goes for your desire to make Hispanics, Blacks Whites and Asians all pay their fair share. Whatever that all means." Dec 23, 14 4:40 PM

"Oh now I'm angry about school taxes? I'm fine with my school taxes". Here are some of your prior comments regarding taxes:

I comment mostly on fiscal issues. We don't need nor can we afford these little schools like E Q and Tuckahoe. Consolidation will save millions to taxpayers. You are only giving a self serving opinion. Taxpayers do not need to pay for the nonsense of bloated school districts. " May 31, 13 7:24 AM

Tuckahoe And Southampton Schools Offer Incentive For English Learners
English speaking families who can't use a computer have to go to Suffolk Community college and pay for classes. This is nonsense I'm sick of paying taxes to help the law breakers. You can't be a citizen without knowing English so we are teaching illegal parents English. No I'm not a racist I just don't like people who abuse my country." Mar 29, 13 9:04 AM

Just take a look around here, and see how much illegals cost the school district. Do you think the motel on North Rd with 50 children going to the HB school district is a net positive? Considering they pay $16,000 in real estate taxes, and the students cost the district $1.2 million I would guess not.

If they wanted the best school possible they would be going to a private school. Everybody wants everybody else to pay for their kids. They should be closing East Quogue school and sending them all to Westhampton it would be a helluva lot cheaper" May 22, 13 8:53 AM

we have a lot of liberals that love the American education system.A group that loves to give choices to Americans. The Liberals love the choice of abortion, and the choice for someone to sit at home and not work. Since the American education system is run by liberals and unions they do not like the choice of Education. The American education system isn't even in the top 20 in the world anymore. Why can't parents make educational decisions for their children? Why can't parents send their kids to a Catholic school at half the price , and save taxpayers money? Bubby you brainwashed and sound quite ignorant. Parents have a right to do what's right for their child!" May 23, 13 7:36 AM

Hmmm the reason children can't read is because the school is lacking a computerized reading program? Then you think we should spend more money on advanced educational programs. These school districts need to learn how to teach the basics.You don't need a computer system to teach kids how to read people have been learning how to read for centuries without a computer. I don't know what the total answer is to fixing the educational problem but it sure isn't spending more money because that's obviously hasn't worked" Sep 5, 13 6:56 AM

With the average child costing nearly 30k a year when do we figure out throwing money at education is not working." Sep 5, 13 11:27 AM

" Dec 24, 14 12:05 PM

You can't be simultaneously fine with your school taxes and feel as though you are not getting what you are paying for. For the 3rd time, I am not a teacher, have no reason to hide that fact. Getting ''likes'' in an anonymous website is not an authentic endorsement of anything. You haven't supported a single thing you have stated with facts or evidence and you call character assassin for doing nothing more than placing your own wording up there without qualification. I can afford to pay my taxes, feel like I am getting MORE than I have paid for and my property value is skyrocketing. Merry Christmas, see you on the other side of the holiday. Even Mrs. Claus needs a rest sometimes." Dec 24, 14 1:25 PM

Bishop Leaves Behind Legacy As East End Advocate

I hope you people understand the entertainment value in "Trust me Z I get distance quandary, and I ponder both the size and distance of this and the possibility of other universe's daily. as well as quantum, gravitational and string theory, the limitations of communication due to time vs speed vs mass according to e=mc squared"

not to mention:

Time, speed, and mass are not necessarily relevant. Radioactive decay fluctuates in isotopes on this planet depending on the distance the Earth is from the Sun. Using a rubidium clock in orbit to prove "time slows down" in orbit is a fundamentally flawed proof.

Gravity has an effect on the speed of nuclear decay in an isotope, and decades long experiments have proven such.

This is one lucky village to be populated with so many astrophysicists, deep thinkers and quantum theorists. A rubidium clock!? I've heard it all." Dec 27, 14 8:00 AM

Tim started off well but like so many he lost the battle between his own sense of civic mindfulness and the intoxication of being accepted into the circle of the elite ruling class. Unfortunately for him, he never made it into that Nancy Pelosi orbit despite sliding in lock step with her message and voting direction for the last several years of his lengthy term. It is a shame and I feel sorry for him. He should be retiring with a positive legacy but it is very mixed. The mere mention of Mr. Bishop's name brings about strong, conflicting reactions. One of the few unions he did not end well with was the International Union for Conservation of Nature. That is the body who helped put the piping plover on the Endangered Species act of 1986." Dec 27, 14 8:09 AM

East End Schools Ahead Of State In Introducing Fresh Produce To Students

If the East End is leading New York, Tuckahoe lead the East End in this area. As far back as 4 years they have been growing organic produce for its lunch menu. With regards to the above, there is already an institution created to teach children about local farms. It's called "parent"." Dec 28, 14 10:41 AM

Experts Say More Forms Of HIV Prevention Medication Will Be Available In The Future

Please children. Get an education and do whatever you can to go to college. You will learn to write in a way that will garner you respect and communicate at higher levels of intellectual understanding. An educated mind is an open mind and an open mind is one that will be available to see the opportunities that exist before you. This is terrific news for people suffering from AIDS and HIV. " Dec 31, 14 6:22 AM

Guy is totally illiterate." Dec 31, 14 6:24 AM

There's another name for hetero heroin addicts: Human beings.
This article has nothing to do with you insulated, small minded, colloquial hicks who feel the need to denigrate anything you fear or don't understand. " Jan 2, 15 7:33 AM

The drug is meant to prevent people from getting HIV or AIDS in the first place. It doesn't help people that have already contracted the disease. If an HIV+ mother gives birth, this drug helps to prevent the baby from getting HIV via breastfeeding. This helps to minimize occupational hazards such as those that exist in the centers where AIDS and HIV are treated. Besides this drug, what other drugs are you online ranting about the side effects?

The premise that you can see how a particular group is getting used by a pharmacy company but the group cannot tell relies on you being smarter than them. I can assure you this is not the case.

"Wooo Hooo what a great drug to have. Now people can go back to unprotected sex, and create another strain of a out of control sexually transmitted disease. " By chief1 (1425), southampton on Dec 30, 14 6:09 PM

That's a pretty flippant attitude from someone who, now, wants to attempt to come off caring." Jan 2, 15 12:18 PM

Man Charged With Violating Leandra's Law Clocked In At 106 MPH

I wouldn't want to be in those kids' shoes! Those poor kids must have been scared out of their minds in the cab of this drunk's trunk. This was 3pm in the afternoon! Only luck protected this guy from becoming a murderer. I would love it if the press could do a follow up story. These offenders seem to skate out here only to be picked up again doing the exact same thing while we read about it and scratch our heads." Jan 3, 15 7:59 AM

Experts Say More Forms Of HIV Prevention Medication Will Be Available In The Future

There is a bridge in Hampton Bays. You should cross it sometimes. " Jan 3, 15 8:01 AM

Chef, this is the thing. This drug is not new - it is just new to you. We don't have to guess as to the validity of your bias tinged, dire predictions. The medicine is in its third year of approval from the FDA and exhibits an extremely high efficacy rate. So far all that has taken place is that people that were at high risk to get HIV and AIDS are not getting it. It is extraordinary that this upsets you so. " Jan 4, 15 8:45 AM

You got stats to back that up chef?" Jan 4, 15 1:59 PM

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