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Mar 3, 2010 12:20 PMPublication: The Southampton Press

Southampton Town Board candidates face off in final debate

Mar 3, 2010 12:20 PM

Southampton Town Board candidates William Hughes and Bridget Fleming squared off in their third and final debate last Wednesday, February 24, before a special election slated for Tuesday, March 9.

The debate, hosted by the League of Women Voters of the Hamptons at the Southampton Cultural Center in Southampton Village, drew an audience of approximately 100 people, many of whom submitted questions on topics ranging from development and infrastructure to the economy and town finances. Questions also were provided by members of the League, The Southampton Press and the Sag Harbor Express.

Throughout the 90-minute discussion, Ms. Fleming, a Democrat who has been cross-endorsed by the Independence Party, argued that she would add balance to a Town Board that is currently dominated by a Republican-Conservative coalition, while Mr. Hughes, a Republican, drew on his deep roots in Southampton Town and sought to portray himself as the more fiscally conservative choice.

Both Ms. Fleming, an attorney who lives in Noyac, and Mr. Hughes, a Southampton Town Police lieutenant from Hampton Bays who recently filed his retirement papers, agreed on one point—that there are clear differences between their approaches to government.

Those differences were highlighted in a disagreement over the Town Board’s February 23 decision to table a resolution that would have created a new sustainability coordinator position at Town Hall. The new post would have been financed by a federal grant, and the appointee charged with overseeing conservation programs and serving as a go-to person for environmental issues.

“This is a new position,” said Mr. Hughes, who said he opposes the resolution because it would create a new expense for the town. “It is grant money that doesn’t go on forever.”

He said that he would instead prefer to select a current town employee to fulfill those responsibilities.

Ms. Fleming, on the other hand, explained that the sustainability coordinator would be responsible for securing future grants to fund his or her position, and that he or she would provide a valuable service for the public.

“That vote was a shame last night,” she said, referring to the Town Board decision made on February 23. “If I had been on the board, I would have voted ‘yes.’”

At the same board meeting, Highway Superintendent Alex Gregor was denied a request for a $4 million bond for road work, which is $2 million more than the town had originally budgeted. Mr. Hughes said he agreed with the 
Town Board’s decision to hold off on the additional funds, explaining that Mr. Gregor was told to come back in the spring if he still needed the extra money.

Mr. Fleming argued that the town’s roads are in dire need of repair, and that it would cost less to fix them now. “He is not going to be able to do the same job by waiting,” she said.

On the topic of creating a town-funded hiring hall for day laborers, Mr. Hughes offered a resounding “no,” while Ms. Fleming said that it was a “difficult question” that required further consideration.

“I would never force a community to take on a solution that they do not fully support,” she added.

Both Mr. Hughes and Ms. Fleming expressed support for fixed shifts for Southampton Town Police officers, who currently work eight-hour rotating shifts, which periodically bounce officers between night and day shifts. The Southampton Town Patrolman’s Benevolent Association’s contract with the town expired in 2008, and the two sides are scheduled to go to arbitration for a new contract in March. In recent months, the PBA, which has endorsed Ms. Fleming, has been pushing for fixed 12-hour shifts for town officers, allowing them to work fewer days per year.

“I believe that police officers in the Town of Southampton deserve fixed shifts,” said Mr. Hughes, who has been a member of the Southampton Town Police Department for 29 years. However, he said he did not support 12-hour shifts. “Twelve-hour shifts are unsafe for police officers, the public and cost more,” he said.

Ms. Fleming agreed that “steady shifts are very important,” but did not say how long they should be.

The PBA has also stated that it will seek pay raises in its next contract. Both Mr. Hughes and Ms. Fleming said it was important that the raises be moderate.

“Pay raises should be in line with [the consumer price index] and cost of living,” Mr. Hughes said.

Ms. Fleming said the PBA expressed last year that it would be willing to make concessions in its contract. “We will be able to rein in the spending,” she said.

When asked to identify the biggest challenge that Southampton Town is currently facing, Ms. Fleming said it is the national economic downturn. “We’ve got to do what we can to stimulate the economy,” she said. “We need jobs and we need to keep our businesses vital and thriving.”

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Thank You Joe Shaw for neglecting the FRNCA Meet the Cnadidates Night on Monday.
By Terry (380), Southampton on Feb 25, 10 3:14 PM
1 member liked this comment
Wait til March 4th to read the whole article-what media world does 27east live in? First you ignore the Monday night meeting and than you are going to report on Wed's meeting 8 days later. Mr Shaw-the 1980's are over.
By EastEnd68 (888), Westhampton on Feb 25, 10 3:24 PM
Bill Hughes repeated and repeated a few tired talking points -- smart growth, balancing the checkbook, "I know how to lead", etc., and this won robotic applause from the dittoheads. Bridget Fleming, on the other hand, demonstrated admirable breadth and depth of knowledge on the issues, plus regular, direct contact with key players on a number of critical matters such as transportation and fiscal reform.

Speaking of fiscal reform, Bill Hughes belongs to the same Republican Party that lost ...more
By fidelis (199), westhampton beach on Feb 25, 10 4:33 PM
I thought they down graded the deficit to 5 million per the comptroller Tamara.
Where was ATH in 2008 when it came time to retire some police officers. Knowing a 5 million existed in the PD she would not vote to retire anyone. Thats the reason the SHPD used for endorsing her.
Fleming demonstated no knowledge of any of the issues but did a good job skirting them. If I remember correctly Fleming stated at the FRENCA debate that the PD endorsed her, but that is not mentioned in any of ads. ...more
By reg rep (408), Southampton on Feb 25, 10 7:28 PM
Read a bit and catch up on the facts. There is no "missing" fifteen million dollars.It was a figment of the imagination of both Kabot and ATH. You want "talking points"? Look at Ms Flemings campaign rhetoric and compare it to ANY Democratic candidate running for town office over the last 30 years. It is all boiler plate babble.
There are no "superfluous" cops at SHTPD. They are cops who have completed 20 years of service who have chosen to remain.Where the word "admittedly" comes ...more
By Terry (380), Southampton on Feb 26, 10 8:36 AM
1 member liked this comment
The "pd" does not endorse anyone. The Southampton Town PBA may have endorsed a candidate, but not the PD.
By Terry (380), Southampton on Feb 26, 10 2:05 PM
1 member liked this comment
I would like to point out that if you do not enforce town codes it will lead to more issues, whether it be violations or crimes. In fact the “Broken Windows Theory” which was extremely effective in NYC during the 1990’s implies that if you enforce small codes/laws it will prevent bigger infractions from happening.
I would also like to point out that the Southampton Town PBA is not backing Bill Hughes, they are backing Bridget Fleming. Why? Mrs. Fleming is willing to negotiate a pay raise for ...more
By danhfarrell (3), Southampton on Feb 27, 10 1:11 AM
Where was "Bill " on those interfund cash transfers occurring between the police dept. fund & other town funds including the general fund. This is from the FTI's police audlt. Bill says he does his check book
monthly at home, but not paying attention on the job.
By fix-it-now (216), sag harbor on Feb 25, 10 6:29 PM
1 member liked this comment
Bill Hughes was arresting the bad guys while the democrats on the TB at the time did nothing but spend the tax payers money .
Vote for Bill Hughes for Town Board.
By reg rep (408), Southampton on Feb 25, 10 7:31 PM
rep reg --- read the FTI police fund audlt --- it's on your town web site.
By fix-it-now (216), sag harbor on Feb 25, 10 7:49 PM
Those "interfund" transfers are done at Town Hall, not at the Departments within the town. The deficits refered to are in no way a reflection of any managers, and you would be the first to say they are.
By Terry (380), Southampton on Feb 26, 10 8:38 AM
1 member liked this comment
Lets be reminded during the years this deficit happened was when the town had a democrat majority.
Bridget Fleming offered no solution to anything and skirted most questions posed to her, she never directly answered any of the questions. She is trying to hide the fact that she is just so liberal and would love to see a hiring hall. This is her 2nd time doing this, she should be better prepared with answers on all issues.
She is an empty skirt with no vision and no idea's for SH town. She ...more
By reg rep (408), Southampton on Feb 25, 10 6:48 PM
You're misrepresenting at least three things, reg rep: [1] The Town Board had a Democratic (the correct word) majority for only a part of the time when the deficits occurred, but more importantly, the Supervisors during that time were all Republicans, and the Supervisor is the chief financial officer of the Town. [2] The only person who went on record last night as being for a hiring hall was Bill Hughes, if it were a private undertaking with no tax dollars. We don't know if Bridget Fleming ...more
By fidelis (199), westhampton beach on Feb 25, 10 8:22 PM
2 members liked this comment
huh? do you just hit the replay button???
By EQme (112), East Quogue on Feb 25, 10 10:11 PM
my reply below was to you, reg rep
By EQme (112), East Quogue on Feb 25, 10 10:13 PM
(1) The Supervisor may have been Republican, but the Democratic majority passed the budget, during the years when the budget went from 40 mil to 80 mil.
(2) Bridget made NOTHING clear as she still wants to "gather the community and come to a concensus"
(3) The reality is that after the money runs out, a tax increase is required to fund the position.
By Terry (380), Southampton on Feb 26, 10 8:42 AM
Having worked in a variety of state & county positions I can attest to the fact that after the grant goes, the position goes. People don't necessarily get fired, their job just goes away. As the State High Dept. due to outside contractors doing maintenance projects, many jobs just disappeared. Yes, the town could decide they need to create a job for this person duties, they could do that whether or not they use the grant money at this time. Not utilizing the grant doesn't preclude them from ...more
By bb (922), Hampton Bays on Mar 4, 10 9:23 AM
In her campaign ads Ms. Fleming says her husband is a local contractor. Now Ms. Fleming,for the record, does your husband use illegals in his business (which I guess is also yours)? Is this why you cannot answer
this "difficult question" about a Town-funded hiring hall?
By nellie (451), sag harbor on Feb 25, 10 7:25 PM
It's certainly true that a string of endorsements shouldn't be enough to get a person elected, but there's got to be a reason why some people get endorsements and other people don't. Bill Hughes isn't endorsed by a single organization except the Republican Party, and I don't know of any major officeholder who's come out for him. Bridget Fleming, on the other hand, is endorsed by the Democrats, the Independence Party, the Long Island Environmental Forum, the Southampton Town PBA, Fred Thiele, Tim ...more
By fidelis (199), westhampton beach on Feb 25, 10 8:06 PM
It really says nothing. One cannot expect Bishop or Thiele to support anyone but a Dem. To many who question Hughes' police background no endorsement from STPBA should be a comfort. Frankly, this is the worst candidate choice in years.
By nellie (451), sag harbor on Feb 25, 10 8:15 PM
2 members liked this comment
Bill Hughes claims to be a "pretty conservative Republican", in his words last night. Why hasn't the Conservative Party endorsed him? Again, it has to tell you something.
By fidelis (199), westhampton beach on Feb 25, 10 8:25 PM
good question
By nellie (451), sag harbor on Feb 25, 10 8:27 PM
Ok, so the STPBA endorsement is what you are looking for in a candidate? I'm sorry, I thought everybody was holding that *against* ATH.

Maybe the PBA hasn't endorsed Hughes because they know they cannot expect any favors from him. He's been on the inside and knows exactly where the overtime expenses are (for both PO's and supervisors.. and the supervisors overtime is a good topic to discuss), as well as the other unecessary expenses.

If you look at his record, the squads Hughes' ...more
By diy_guy (101), Southampton on Feb 27, 10 7:17 PM
Yes, that BF is a party hack and Bill Hughs is all for the suffering tax payer.
By fazool (22), Southampton on Mar 5, 10 11:56 PM
I was at the CAC meeting in Hampton Bays and also the CAC meeting in Flanders. No one has mentioned or made any comments about the moderators at both meeting shutting down questions or cutting off questions from the public. I was not at the League of Women Voters debate and heard that someone was also shut down by the moderator from asking a question.
I cannot believe that grown people cannot find a way to find a way for this to happen. Who puts these people in charge. More importantly ...more
By RonM (8), Hampton Bays on Feb 25, 10 8:51 PM
1 member liked this comment
You were shut down because by your own words " I have no questions, but I want to make 2 statements" is not consistent with a Candidates Nights. No one came to hear your statements. They came to hear questions asked and answered by the candidates.
By Terry (380), Southampton on Feb 26, 10 8:46 AM
1 member liked this comment
I see many comment on MacArthur's speech to West Point but I don't see comment where he talks about "hallowed traditions of liberty and freedom, of right and justice" Freedom of speech is one of those rights and when the host in Flanders said he would decide if a question is right to ask he took all of our rights of free speech away. When Hampton Bays said no you can't ask a question on abortion, as MacArthur said have 'morals grown to low' to have this question asked?
By Jr (7), Sag Harbor on Feb 27, 10 5:22 AM
No, what the host (me) said was I would only accept questions appropriate for the event. No one, not even you made it an issue when I said that.
The only people who didn't like that were those who would ask a question intended to spark debate not germane to Southampton Town and the election.
I was told by people on both sides of the aisle that they enjoyed the way the Q and A was done. And only you and one other had issues.
By Terry (380), Southampton on Feb 28, 10 12:41 PM
Hughes was third from the top in the chain of command --- it seems he should have known something about the inter fund cash transfers in & out of the dept., cause he was not out writing tickets ... his boys were doing that while he is sitting back at the office with the chief.
By fix-it-now (216), sag harbor on Feb 25, 10 8:54 PM
Fix it now
Another typical answer, now it's Hughes fault for the deficit in the PD. You dems will try to spin this anyway you can.
By reg rep (408), Southampton on Feb 26, 10 12:46 AM
Once again, a Dem spin. The "inter funds transfers" were done at the Comptrollers office. It has NOTHING to do with the Town PD.
To accuse Bill Hughes of "sitting back at the office" while his "boys" are out writing tickets, tells me you have never met the man.
First of all, he had "boys" and "girls" working for him at the PD. Second, he is, and always has been an "in the trenches" kind of leader.
If you want to try spinning something, you have to have a little bit of something to ...more
By Terry (380), Southampton on Feb 26, 10 8:52 AM
Keep posting, the more you do the more it is evident that you have no idea what it is you are talking about.
By Bayman1 (297), Sag Harbor on Feb 26, 10 5:37 PM
fidelis and nelli - local Conservatives are fully with Hughes. Their abilty to endorse was taken away by the County Con Party which made a deal with County Indy Party to back Flemming. Yeah I know must come as some shock a candidate on the D line benfitting from deals with the up west power brokers. Nice thing about it is it will motivate local Conservatives to come out and support Hughes. As we all know they really don't like being told what to do, especially when it means endorsing a liberal democrat.
By DJII13 (155), Hampton Bays on Feb 25, 10 9:02 PM
Another sad example of the west dictating the east end's destiny. Sounds like the time for a Peconic Conservative Party has come.
By nellie (451), sag harbor on Feb 25, 10 9:18 PM
Yea...Yea...Nellie and DJ, We know the drill, you call Fleming this, and accuse her husband of that, the fact is you are trying to figure out how this conservative Republican couldn't get the Conservative line. "Yea, that’s it....it must have been a deal west."
Face it your guy couldn’t deliver the Conservative endorsement, just like he couldn't deliver the Independence endorsement.
I bet that you’re not happy.
By SHNative (554), Southampton on Feb 25, 10 9:46 PM
Not my guy. I don't like either candidate. Fleming and Hughes are the worse choice of candidates in years.
By nellie (451), sag harbor on Feb 25, 10 10:19 PM
2 members liked this comment
Still waiting for some "proof" of your outrageous claims on other threads.
To this point: Facts are Mr Walsh has stated that the reason he did not endorse Mr Hughes was (a) he prefered Fred Thieles' hand picked candidate and (b) Mr Hughes was at one time a registered Con and left. This is the way Mr Walsh chose to punish him.
By Terry (380), Southampton on Feb 26, 10 8:57 AM
fidelis it’s typical of you to down play the role of the democrats during those years. Have you read the paper the deficit has now been reduced to 5 million, not fifteen million you mentioned above. The supervisor is the chief financial officer, but they are not CPA's that is the job of the comptroller to keep the books straight. Who did the town get to audit the books, It wasn’t ATH, she not capable.

Bridget will not go on the record with a yes or no answer re: hiring hall is because she ...more
By reg rep (408), Southampton on Feb 26, 10 12:36 AM

Reg Rep: Your posts always show a severe lack of understanding of complex issues. You are suggesting that the deficit was always merely $5 Million, not a higher amount. If you reread the article on the FTI findings and Tamara's statements, the deficits were much larger than $5 Million, but they applied unused balances on Town approved capital projects as an emergency measure, cancelled them if possible, and offset much of the other deficit accounts with them.

So the costs to the Town ...more
By Observant (14), southampton on Feb 26, 10 7:38 PM
The conservative's in SH will never vote for a liberal democrat like Bridget, she is just too left. After all look at some of those that endorsed her, Tim Bishop better start packing up his office. He is done in November.
By reg rep (408), Southampton on Feb 26, 10 12:44 AM
Hey SHNative, no need to take my word for it. It was widely reported what went down witht the Conservative endorsement and of course you could do the intellectually honest thing and ask one of the local party members if you were willing to let the facts get inthe way of your partisan narrative. And with all due repsect, I ididn't call Ms. Flemming anything, other than to state the obvious, that she is a liberal democrat from the classic tradition. Lockstep on Obamacare and certain in the abilty ...more
By DJII13 (155), Hampton Bays on Feb 26, 10 8:06 AM
And for the record I no more consider describing someone as a liberal Democrat any more negative than describing someone as a conservative Republican. They are both honorable philosophical differences in our politcal culture and history. This race just happens to be a classic match up in that regard.
By DJII13 (155), Hampton Bays on Feb 26, 10 8:10 AM
I read no reports about what "went down with the Conservative Party endorsement", other than the claimes on these posts The fact is we do not know why they did not choose to endorse either candidate.
I bet that you probably know, and it has nothing to do with the Conservative county chair.
By SHNative (554), Southampton on Feb 26, 10 8:57 AM
See my response above, it has EVERYTHING to do with the County Chair.
It may be difficult for you to grasp that as I am reporting the above as fact that I can back up and will gladly meet with you and do so.
By Terry (380), Southampton on Feb 26, 10 9:00 AM
Obvioulsy SHNative you only admit to reading what suits your agenda - it was an upwest deal plain and simple. Thiele joins INDY Party, and makes deal to be paid off in part by INDY Party and CON Party Chair strong arming local Republicans into nominating his pick - from Newsday -

Suffolk Conservative chair rejects S'hampton GOP pick
Monday January 18, 2010 12:43 PM By Rick Brand

Southampton Republicans may have named retiring town police lieutenant Bill Hughes as their special-election ...more
By DJII13 (155), Hampton Bays on Feb 26, 10 9:55 AM
And this SHNative is from the SH Press Jan 22 edition -
Mr. Walsh said he would not endorse Mr. Hughes because he was not involved in the Republican Party’s process of selecting him as their candidate. He said GOP leaders at the town level contacted him after last week’s convention and asked him to endorse Mr. Hughes, but Mr. Walsh favored another candidate for the Republican nomination, Rebecca Molinaro, and said he felt she was unfairly penalized because she works for New York State Assemblyman ...more
By DJII13 (155), Hampton Bays on Feb 26, 10 10:00 AM
Thanks to FRNCA for hosting a lively and well attended debate on Monday evening that unfortunately was not covered by the SH press. What a shame. They would have had a field day with the assertion made by Mr. Hughes that he would look to former town supervisor Patrick (Skip) Heaney (who was in attendance) for ideas, help and support for his future decisions. To quote the Marx Brothers "Can you get Stucco? Oh boy can you get stucco!"
By barberosa (39), Watermill on Feb 26, 10 11:02 AM
3 members liked this comment
What I learned from the debate: Mr Hughes if for "God and country" and his solution to every single problem is to "balance the check book".
By peoplefirst (787), Southampton on Feb 26, 10 12:13 PM
Someday take the time to read Douglas MacArthurs speech to the cadets at West Point in 1962.
"Duty, honor, country" Is it so hard for you to fathom that indeed people use that as their mantra and follow it in spirit and deed?
By Terry (380), Southampton on Feb 26, 10 12:39 PM
How does it translate to governing? It doesn't. It isnothing more than a tired platitude used by conservatives to appeal to their hawkish base and to distract from the fact that they have no actual proposals
By setyoufree (69), Sag Harbor on Feb 26, 10 5:01 PM
Apparent that you either did not read or are not capable of grasping the message in the speech.

Please expound upon your description of a conservative as "hawkish"
By Terry (380), Southampton on Feb 26, 10 6:53 PM
1 member liked this comment
Hard to argue against Mr. Hughes on that point. Leaders willing and able to balance the check book are a simultaneaoulsy good and rare solution for most of the problems we face at the town government level.
By DJII13 (155), Hampton Bays on Feb 26, 10 12:16 PM
2 members liked this comment
For Terry and reg rep, I don't know about you, but I think five million dollars down the deficit hole is still an awful lot of money, especially when it's our money. Even if you're right about the size of the Republican deficit, I presume you're not dismissing it as chump change. Bottom line, they lost an inexcusable amount of our money.
I'm calling it a Republican deficit because the foul-up didn't occur when the Town Board passed the budgets,as Terry suggests. The foul-up occurred when the ...more
By fidelis (199), westhampton beach on Feb 26, 10 12:45 PM
1 member liked this comment
On this point I agreee. 5 mil is a lot of dinero. But it is not the 15 mil that you posted. And keep in mind what happened during the last few years bringing us frighteningly close to the second great depression. Home sales virtually stopped and mortgage tax revenue went from unbelieveable amounts to zero. So while 5 mil is a lot and some painful cuts will be needed to make up for it, its not the end of the world.
Spin as you like, when the grant money is gone, unless someone on the board ...more
By Terry (380), Southampton on Feb 26, 10 1:58 PM
May I add publius, I am not hiding behind a name, I am Terry Flanagan, so if ( and I readily state I may be wrong here) your comments on my being at the LWV debate was a veiled attempt to call me out, you would be spitting in the wind.
By Terry (380), Southampton on Feb 26, 10 2:08 PM
Terry, you say you may be wrong, and indeed you are. I knew who you were, both from surmise and from your own statement elsewhere on this site. Knowing who you are, I said I didn't see you at the Southampton debate, though I could have missed you.
You're also wrong (still) about the financial disaster. The foul-ups that caused the Town's deficits took place much earlier than the last few years when the housing market tanked. It's true, however, that the Republican administrations imprudently ...more
By fidelis (199), westhampton beach on Feb 26, 10 4:29 PM
Great point Terry, interesting no one has picked up on that but you. Where is our good friend Highhatsize? He usually chimes in on issues like these.
By Bayman1 (297), Sag Harbor on Feb 26, 10 5:41 PM
There was no "personal opinion" of Chief Overton stated. I just reported some facts.

If the "foul ups" occurred "much earlier", as you state, then the blame goes to the boards when a Democratic majority controlled.

By the way, my apologies for refering to you as publius.
By Terry (380), Southampton on Feb 26, 10 6:48 PM
Fidelis, my extreme gratitiude to you for revealing yours and Ms. Flemming's true feelings. Only a complete liberal would believe that the Congressman Bishop and Assemblyman Thiele could do anything to create private sector jobs here in Southampton. Government doesn't create jobs, the private sector does.
As for the hiring hall, Ms. Flemming is in a trap. Having seemingly come out in favor last fall and seeing that backfire, instead of directly answering the question, she now dances around ...more
By DJII13 (155), Hampton Bays on Feb 26, 10 2:08 PM
1 member liked this comment
I don't know what radio or TV station you watch or listen to but the State of NY is bankrupt they are withholding our NYS Refunds to help sure up there own budgets.
As far as the Feds they are nothing but trillions of debt. So get real, with this pipe dream of Bishop or Thiele getting any money for Bridget to get the economy moving. Again the only thing who is moving is Bishop right out of office in November.
By reg rep (408), Southampton on Feb 26, 10 4:22 PM
Bridget Flemming is a stuttering babbling fool. She NEVER answers a question. She beats around a bush.She has been asked the same question reguarding a hiring hall since she ran for office last November and her answer has been I need to think about it. Shes had 6 months to think about it. Grow up and give your answer. This is typical of a Laywer. She answers a question with a question. Thats NOT the person we need on the Town Board. We need someone who will represent the community not just a party.
By lifesaver (118), speonk on Feb 26, 10 4:38 PM
1 member liked this comment

Terry and Bill Hughes: "Duty, Honor, Country". Spare us the out of place, ultra-Conservative, pulled out of the sky, knee jerk, out of context right wing false patriotism!

Totally out of context. Are you suggesting that those three meaningless platitudes as setyoufree properly points out, sets Hughes apart from Bridget; or that Bridget has done something that could remotely be considered anti-duty, anti-honor, or anti-country? Did Bill have any reason to even suggest that somehow those ...more
By Common Sense (56), Southampton on Feb 26, 10 8:33 PM
1 member liked this comment
Twice you state that I posted "out of context" and twice you are wrong. My response was to "peoplefirst" and thus, in context. In refering to General MacArthurs speech, it is known as "Duty, Honor, Country", again totally in context. That he was adressing cadets at West Point in 1962 was MY post, so you need not point that out to me. That General MacArhtur was a flawed human being (as we all are) is also known to me. That he was fired for wanting to start WWIII? A complete falsehood, He was fired ...more
By Terry (380), Southampton on Feb 27, 10 11:21 AM
..."this is little southampton"..... which stretches from Wainscott to Eastport, hunhh, I guess not so little.
By Bayman1 (297), Sag Harbor on Feb 27, 10 7:43 PM
Another night of Mummenschanz where the topic whose name no citizen dares breathe and no candidate dares address is unspoken, and the STPD continues to totter forward on arthritic million dollar legs.

PATRONAGE. The Town Board retains cops to the tune of $2.6M/yr., many or most of whom should have been retired on their twentieth anniversary of service as provided in the Town code.

However, if you are a candidate for Town Board, remember the fate of the last board member who brought ...more
By highhatsize (4217), East Quogue on Feb 26, 10 8:44 PM
Make that $3.6M/yr. Pardon the typo.
By highhatsize (4217), East Quogue on Feb 26, 10 8:49 PM
Hat Size,
Have you considered that the Town Board may be skeptical of enforcing that section of Town Code/Retirement Law due to the inevitable constitutional argument of age discrimination that willbe brought forth by the netharious PBA?
By taxraven (26), Southampton on Feb 26, 10 9:14 PM
Action by the STPB PBA and the NYS Ass. of PBAs is a virtual certainty, but I think that the candidates are silent for more selfish reasons.

By highhatsize (4217), East Quogue on Feb 26, 10 9:40 PM
Nice to see you chime in Highhatsize, I thought you may have been on vacation.
By Bayman1 (297), Sag Harbor on Feb 27, 10 7:44 PM
Give me a break, look what happened when Easthampton Town elected a retired Police Lieutenant. 30 million in the hole and still sinking. Fleming has the experience and Hughes doesn't have the knowledge or experience for this job. I would like to hear Mr hughes real opininions on hiring halls and illegal immigrants. And not the political watered downed version of an answer he gave that night. "Short fuse" Hughes will surface eventually and its going to be ugly.
By rocky (79), shampton on Feb 26, 10 11:15 PM
1 member liked this comment
Easthampton elected a DEMOCRAT retired police Lieutenant.

Please expound on Ms Flemings experience in municpal finance matters.

If you want more of an explanation of his opinions on anything, he can be contracted via his website. Cal him, ask your questions and then post them here or in the forums.
By Terry (380), Southampton on Feb 27, 10 9:02 AM
"Short fuse Hughes"? What's that about?
By fidelis (199), westhampton beach on Feb 27, 10 5:27 PM
" I would like to hear Mr hughes real opininions on hiring halls and illegal immigrants."

What makes you think you HAVEN'T heard it, Rocky? Mr. Hughes has been straight forward, as opposed to Ms. Fleming to has equivocated every time the subject is raised. (I attended one, and rely on the reports here on the others.)

And exactly what do you assert the election of a Police Lieutenant in East Hampton has to do with their debt problems?

It sounds as if you're randomly "flinging ...more
By Frank Wheeler (1826), Northampton on Feb 28, 10 11:31 AM
Because Bridget is an attorney, that does not automatically give her the experience or qualify her to be a town board member.
I believe Mr. Hughes gave his real opinion on hiring halls; he is not in favor of one if it would cost the tax payers any money. He said right out front NO. It was Bridget who said in the last election that she would like to see one but this time danced around the issue. She is a phony just like ATH who will give this town away.

To compare the past supervisor ...more
By reg rep (408), Southampton on Feb 27, 10 8:43 AM
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No more NYC attorneys,. Didn't we learn from "Trust Sally" Pope who was one of the most inept Board members in years?
By nellie (451), sag harbor on Feb 27, 10 6:53 PM
Over 70 posts and none of you have a clue because you're all tied up in partisan politics on a national basis and for some ridiculous reason believe that the big parties should have something to do with local elections.

This town will continue to have lightweights in office if the only ones who can get elected are those foisted upon us by the Republicans and Democrats.

How about some intelligent, experienced business administrators getting the financial support needed to mount ...more
By VOS (1241), WHB on Feb 28, 10 1:11 AM
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Tell us how you would do it. Seriously.
By Terry (380), Southampton on Feb 28, 10 8:54 AM
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What I find interesting is that the NYS Retirement Law says a member of the Police Department can work till their 55 years old and Sergeants and above can work till their 60 years of age. So I wonder how old Lieutenant William Hughes is? And is he running for election only to supplement his enormous pension or is it a true calling of service that he is stating? Short fuse Hughes will be revealed soon!!
By rocky (79), shampton on Feb 28, 10 9:21 AM
Once again, Rocky, what do you mean by calling the man "short fuse Hughes", and what is it that will be revealed soon? Innuendo is not appropriate or fair. If you have something to say, then say it, please.
By fidelis (199), westhampton beach on Feb 28, 10 9:56 AM
Well, what do you think, rocky? If he was a 19 year old in Vietnam in 1969, do the math and figure out how old he is. That should challenge you.
Now, pick up the phone and call the candidate and ask if he is just "doing this to supplement his income" Let us know how you make out.
By Terry (380), Southampton on Feb 28, 10 12:35 PM
Rocky it has been stated elsewhere that Mr. Hughes is 59 years old. By comparison, it has been also stated the Ms. Flemming is 49 years old.
By DJII13 (155), Hampton Bays on Feb 28, 10 10:53 AM
The last thing we need is another "proud conservative" with no ideas, but a worthless litany of republican talking points.
By fcmcmann (417), Hampton Bays on Feb 28, 10 1:00 PM
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Terry: You sound like a member of Mr. Hughes campaign staff instead of an independent mind like you want us to believe. If you insist on inappropriately and "out of context" using historical references to beef up Mr. Hughes' image, you should at least know what you're talking about and not limit your political history to those of certain political persuasions only. I suggest you do further historical readings.

You state: "That General MacArhtur was a flawed human being (as we all are) ...more
By Common Sense (56), Southampton on Mar 1, 10 1:15 AM
You are right on target here, common sense. Rather than dealing with local issues in a straight forward and direct manner, Mr. Hughes is campaigning using his parties national talking points. Mr. Hughes is constantly talking about "god and country" but what does that have to do with what is happening in our town?

What does "god and country" actually mean? Well, the real message is that if you are not a conservative, you are not for God and country. You are something "other." It is ...more
By peoplefirst (787), Southampton on Mar 1, 10 9:38 AM
Can't fool you can I? While I am not a "member of his campaign staff" nothing I've posted here would indicate that I am an independent. Yes I am endorsing and voting for Mr Hughes. Just like fidelis, you and others are endorsing and voting for Ms Fleming.
You can spend as much time as you like looking through any websites you like to come up with a theory that bolsters your argument (or any argument for that matter) President Truman, in order to ensure civilian control over the military ...more
By Terry (380), Southampton on Mar 1, 10 1:32 PM
It would be interesting if at the special election there were three choices. 1 for Bridget Fleming, 2 for Bill Hughes and 3 for neither. Which choice would get the most votes. Honestly, neither of the candidates is worthy of the vacant seat. There have to be better choices out there.
By lifesaver (118), speonk on Mar 1, 10 7:17 AM
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Then run
By fcmcmann (417), Hampton Bays on Mar 1, 10 9:28 AM
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Unfortunately it costs alot of money.
By lifesaver (118), speonk on Mar 1, 10 10:01 AM
You're correct, but sometimes the right message can be more powerful than cash
By peoplefirst (787), Southampton on Mar 1, 10 10:16 AM
Ideally that is the way it should work.
By fix-it-now (216), sag harbor on Mar 1, 10 10:43 AM
I'm still very uncomfortable about Rocky's cryptic comments above: "Short fuse Hughes will surface eventually and it's going to be ugly", and "Short fuse Hughes will be revealed soon." I've been critical of Bill Hughes in my comments here, and I agree with the criticisms of him that others have raised, but those observations are based on fact, not innuendo. These veiled accusations and hints about coming revelations that Rocky is peddling have no place in the discussion unless she tells us what ...more
By fidelis (199), westhampton beach on Mar 1, 10 11:36 AM
Uncomfortable enough to chastise him ( Rocky) for bringing it up with no facts, but comfortable enough in your desire to attack Mr Hughes by bringing it two or three more times?
I am sure that you have read all of Rocky's comments and seen how reliable and forthright he is, correct? (can you measure the sarcasm?)
You're sinking pretty low there fidelis.
By Terry (380), Southampton on Mar 1, 10 1:37 PM
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You do me an injustice, Terry. I try to defend your guy from cheap shots because, regardless of his unsuitability for the Town Board, he's obviously an honorable man with a sterling record of service for which we should all be grateful, and as I said, he deserves better. In reply, you say I'm "sinking low". Of course, you might say that Bill Hughes can defend himself (or that can you can defend him, as you've been doing rather well all along), but it's not entirely about Bill Hughes. It's more ...more
By fidelis (199), westhampton beach on Mar 1, 10 2:13 PM
And this is the thrird time you "called him out" on this item.
By Terry (380), Southampton on Mar 1, 10 2:24 PM
At least this time I didn't repeat Rocky's insinuations. Look, instead of focusing on this increasingly sterile exchange, why don't you have a go at the five substantive questions in my 1:55 PM post? I know you've responded some to the first two, about why neither the Conservative Party nor the police organizations are backing this conservative policeman, Bill Hughes, but what does it say about his relations with his own people? If he can't even work with them, how will he be able to work with ...more
By fidelis (199), westhampton beach on Mar 1, 10 2:45 PM
These questions have been asked and answered both here and in public meet the candidates nights. I'll state here for the umpteenth time. If YOU have a question for the candidate, pick up the phone, call him, and note the answer to your questions here. Its fair, honest and you get it right from the horses mouth, so to speak.
Simple as pie.
By Terry (380), Southampton on Mar 1, 10 2:50 PM
Along the lines of substantive debate, as opposed to innuendo, I have to add that no one has offered a satisfactory answer to these questions about Bill Hughes:
1. A professed conservative, Bill Hughes is not endorsed by the Conservative Party. Why not?
2. Bridget Fleming is endorsed by, among others, the Southampton Town PBA, the Police Conference of New York, and the Suffolk County Police Conference. A longtime policeman, Bill Hughes is not backed by the police organizations. Why ...more
By fidelis (199), westhampton beach on Mar 1, 10 1:55 PM
FIdelis you insult people's intelligence when you suggest you are defending Mr. Hughes. Wrapping yourself in the cloak of indignity brings you no honor when you repeat the charge three times yourself. Simliliarly it is intellectually dishonest to suggest therer has not been a satsfactory answer to your point number 1 above. It has been answered multiple times in this thread and others, as well as reported in the Southampton Press and Newsday. But this is from a guy who now admits to being partisan ...more
By DJII13 (155), Hampton Bays on Mar 1, 10 2:48 PM
Fidelis, number 1 -
Bill Hiughes did not recieve the Conservative line because the County Conservative Chairman took that power away from the local party because he was not bale to dictate to the SH GOP that they designate someone else. The local Conservative Committee was all set to go with Mr. Hughes until this occured. Terry would know, he sits on their board. This was all about a deal between the County Con chair and the County Indy Chair to reward Fred Thiele with the choice of his candidate. ...more
By DJII13 (155), Hampton Bays on Mar 1, 10 2:57 PM
FIdelis Number 2 -
Ms. Flemming's endorsement by the PBA is a reflection that her vote like that of ATH for a new contract is bought and paid for. To avoid that conflict of interest Mr. Hughes did not bother to seek those endorsements.
By DJII13 (155), Hampton Bays on Mar 1, 10 3:00 PM
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Fidelis Number 3 -
This is an example of Ms. Flemming's campaign not having anything to go after Mr. Hughes on, so you are reaching. Perhaps thats how you feel about your own militaty back ground, but you spitting in the wind. Mr. Hughes has a long history of working in community groups acorss the town, coaching kids teams with other coaches, and working in teams in collabrative envirnmnets. He was well known in town hall for being an easy guy to work with across departments.
By DJII13 (155), Hampton Bays on Mar 1, 10 3:32 PM
fidelis asks:
3. How will Bill Hughes, with his long experience of structured, top-down, that's-an-order interaction in the military and the police, adjust to the back-and-forth of the Town Board, with all its discussion and compromise?
I'll let you ask him directly, or look around here for all the other answers you need, but in this one, here I go.

And what would you say of the thousands of calls he handled as a cop? Everyone of them being an opportunity, ney , a requirement ...more
By Terry (380), Southampton on Mar 1, 10 3:33 PM
Fidelis Number 4 -
We have already addressed why Ms. Flemming was endorsed by Mr. Thiele. Mr. Bishop's endorsement is equally meaningless, the case of one liberal Democrat endorsing another liberal Democrat. Mr. Bishop lock step supports Obamacare, Ms. Flemming rallied in favor of it last summer. In case you missed it, the federal governmnet is going broke as is the state. It's less than a 50/50 chance Mr. Bishop will even be re-elected. No chance of them raining down money.
By DJII13 (155), Hampton Bays on Mar 1, 10 3:37 PM
Fidelis Number 5 -
Mr. Hughes has and can trot out all the elected Republican officials endorsements as well. That is standard operating procedure as you well know. But Mr. Hughes knows the most important endorsement is the one the voters cast on election day, and that is his focus. Not the transparent back slapping your cnadidate seems to take such comfort in.
By DJII13 (155), Hampton Bays on Mar 1, 10 3:40 PM
Regarding why the PBA endorsed who did will be answered in this weeks paper. I hope it puts to bed any rumors or speculation that is out there.

Patrick M. Aube', President
Southampton Town PBA
By pbapres (6), Speonk on Mar 1, 10 3:55 PM
Why the mystery? You do not need to wait for this weeks paper. Use this forum and tell us now so at least this aspect of the arguments concerning this endorsement can be resolved or enhanced.
By nellie (451), sag harbor on Mar 1, 10 9:43 PM
If I were Hughes I'd take out an order of protection against DJ113 and Terry who sound a bit like maniacal stalkers. Rather than sounding like well-intentioned and thoughtful conservatives you guys come off like a couple of far-right teabaggers. You are NOT helping your candidate.
By fcmcmann (417), Hampton Bays on Mar 1, 10 4:04 PM
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I disagree with that wholeheartedly fcmcmann, Terry and DJ113 are trying to counter what comes across as absolute nonsense in the way it has been communicated. And quite frankly they are doing a good job at it.
By Bayman1 (297), Sag Harbor on Mar 1, 10 6:19 PM
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There is not very much in this line of comments that is well written, thoughtful, accurate, responsible, relates to the original story, uses critical thinking and (please) a spell checker. Most of it is the output result of constipation of the brain followed by diarrhea of the keyboard. It is painful to read and scorchingly difficult to understand what position, aside from knee-jerk party politics, anyone is taking. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion on everything but I don't want to spend ...more
By foodie (74), Remsenburg on Mar 1, 10 7:09 PM
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Don't mind fcmcmann, it's common for her to throw insults when she doesn't agree with you but has nothing meaningful to add to a conversation.
By teachourkids (36), southampton on Mar 1, 10 9:09 PM
Speaking of stalkers, I think I have one. I would say I am flattered, but knowing your true identity it would be a lie.
By fcmcmann (417), Hampton Bays on Mar 2, 10 9:27 AM
So DJ113, Terry and I are all stalkers? Thank you for proving my point.
By teachourkids (36), southampton on Mar 2, 10 2:08 PM
Oh, give it a rest, teachourkids. I've read some of the inane nonsense you've posted on these boards. You cannot pretend to remain above it all whilst wallowing in the mud alongside everyone else.

Do you have anything relevant to add to the debate, or did you just come here to attack another poster with whom you disagree? A quick scan of the comments on this board and it is clear that you have chosen the latter - sounds like you've got other issues you need to work out.

Back ...more
By peoplefirst (787), Southampton on Mar 2, 10 3:43 PM
Let me try to get us back to the main line of discussion. I submit that we need Bridget Fleming on the Town Board because the present line-up is already too heavily weighed on the Republican/Conservative side, and it will become 4-to-1 if Bill Hughes is elected. To give some idea of why balance is needed, we should be aware that, if Ms. Fleming had been on the Board this year, we would have had: an open and public process for Planning Board appointments, full up-front provision of sufficient ...more
By Turkey Bridge (1979), Quiogue on Mar 2, 10 4:36 PM
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See there you go Turkey Bridge, unaware you are making the case for Mr. Hughes canididacy for most of the electorate. For example, why in the world do we need a sustainabilty coordinator, let alone when the town is fiscally challenged. Wasn't the suggestion of Mr. Malone, that if these duties were in fact important that they be filled by someone already on the payroll, a better idea? Paying for an unneeded position with a federal grant is the ultimate in thinking there is such a thing as a free ...more
By DJII13 (155), Hampton Bays on Mar 2, 10 6:09 PM
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The truth, not the spin, is that the sustainability coordinator position would be paid for with FEDERAL GRANT MONEY. And that in order for that position to continue beyond it's initial time frame, the individual hired would need to seek out FURTHER GRANT MONEY. It costs the town nothing AND the sustainability director would have an opportunity to create jobs and opportunities for local workers. If you guys can't debate the facts, than at least stop trying to mislead.

"Paying for an unneeded ...more
By peoplefirst (787), Southampton on Mar 2, 10 7:12 PM
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I'd like to hear more about Mr. Malone's "broad financial experience" and "acumen." I know that he received his law degree from a fourth tier law school (look it up). In what financial institutions, and in what capacity, did he distinguish himself? So far all he has shown is the ability to act in robotic lockstep with that other Fearless Leader, Chris Nuzzi. God save us.
By rabblerouser (46), Hampton Bays on Mar 3, 10 10:51 AM
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Balance being the argument, I am looking forward to you endorsing a Republican for the Assembly, congress, and maybe the Governors mansion. You know, just to keep things balanced. Cause we all know how well things have gone in Albany since Elliot steamrolled into town. And that Hope and Change thing still needs a little of both.
By Terry (380), Southampton on Mar 2, 10 6:11 PM
2 members liked this comment
Got a mailing from the Fleming folks at the SHT Dem Committee. Wanted to send them a note indicating how unhappy I am as a reg Dem that she can not take a position against using taxpayer money to support a criminal enterprize(hiring hall for illegals). Went to their website to look for an e-mail address and clicked on the issues page. Only thing there is a link to a group that advocates for the criminals who have jumped the border. No wonder she can't give a straight answer on the issue.
By bird (829), Southampton on Mar 2, 10 6:55 PM
can Ms Fleming answer the question re hiring halls and can she answer the question ( as in all her ads that her husband is an independent contractor) if he or any or his subcontractors have ever hired "day" workers. My vote ifor her is there if I see her answers
By xtiego (698), bridgehampton on Mar 2, 10 7:10 PM
and she needs to answerno and no and also substantiate her husband's sub contractors
By xtiego (698), bridgehampton on Mar 2, 10 7:12 PM
And what about you? Will you swear that no one has ever worked for you, with our without your knowledge, who was not a documented citizen? I mean no one, ever. Besides, her husband is not running, Mrs. Fleming is.
By peoplefirst (787), Southampton on Mar 2, 10 7:14 PM
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Does any one know if the health insurance part ($30,000 per the press) of this sustainability coordinator position is allowed to be paid out of this grant money or will the town have to pick up the cost?
Also, all those that are still complaining about the Berkoski appointment to the planning board, I don't remember seeing any complaints when the female democract was re-appointed by the the board. BTW the rep's voted yes to re-appoint her so come on, stop the whining.
Some of you just wont ...more
By reg rep (408), Southampton on Mar 2, 10 9:45 PM
Let us all remeber that the Republicans will have a majority on the Southampton Town board no matter what the result of this election. What you must seriously consider is wheather you want a Republican supermajority.
Do you want a 4-1 majority on the town board?
I do not, and I will Vote for Fleming.
By SHNative (554), Southampton on Mar 2, 10 9:56 PM
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Native - Like you I am not happy about a large Republican majority nor do I believe that Mr. Huges will look out for the taxpayers in the upcoming STPD negotiations. I am however even more concerned with the Southampton Town Dem Party's link to "NISI", an advocate group for those who have jumped the border. The party's link to an organization advocating nullification of criminal acts leads me to believe they do not deserve another seat at the table.
By bird (829), Southampton on Mar 3, 10 9:26 AM
Peoplefirst adding people to government payroll just because you can is how we end up with bloated government no matter the short term funding source. Thr stimulus package was supposed to help the private sector create jobs not grow government or at least that is how Obama, Pelosi and Reid sold it. No position is an island unto it self and there are always added costs of retirement benefits, admistraitve support costs, overhead, another person needing transportation around town and on and on. Creating ...more
By DJII13 (155), Hampton Bays on Mar 3, 10 8:52 AM
There is a clearly identified need for jobs. To protect our children's futures, there is a clearly identified need for a change in the way we live and how we protect our environment. You and your ilk's hate for Obama, Pelosi and Reid is crippling our government. You are allowing your irrational political ideologies to blind you.
By peoplefirst (787), Southampton on Mar 3, 10 9:13 AM
"You and your ilk......"

Now there's a mature, rational attempt at a dialogue.

You're very young, aren't you?
By Frank Wheeler (1826), Northampton on Mar 3, 10 9:51 AM
Is it really so hard for you to believe that people can disagree with each other and not hate?
"A need for jobs" has never been a job of town hall to fill, nor should it be. Others on this sight say we need to keep Bishop and Thiele happy so that we get our fair share of state and fed money. What will happen, Bishop and Thiele won't come through to punish us if Ms Fleming doesnt win? They'll take the loss in November to prove a point?
The reality is, you folks want to sell the Obama/Reid/Pelosi/Patterson ...more
By Terry (380), Southampton on Mar 3, 10 10:25 AM
Sorry I could not contribute something as profound as "Now there's a mature attempt at dialogue." You're very angry, aren't you?
By peoplefirst (787), Southampton on Mar 3, 10 10:38 AM
Frank, you are such a whiner! Really, I thought you neocons had tougher skin.
By fcmcmann (417), Hampton Bays on Mar 3, 10 10:50 AM
Why when talking about local issues must you bring Obama/Reid/Pelosie and now Patterson into the issue? You are attempting to make a larger political point that is completely irrelevant to what is happening locally. Why shouldn't town hall help create and provide jobs? You and Frank make a great team.
By peoplefirst (787), Southampton on Mar 3, 10 10:41 AM
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Simply put, it is not within the area of responsibility of the town to perform such a function (job creation)
Educate me, how would anyone in town hall, regardless of party, create jobs?

Let me add Charlie Rangel into the mix. Sorry can't resist. Just your guys' turn in the hot seat this week. I will be the first to accept that we have tarnished players on both sides.
By Terry (380), Southampton on Mar 3, 10 11:35 AM
A most entertaining comment, Mr. Flanagan. According to my research, the town has not only created jobs for you, your spouse and stepdaughter, but also provides you, a smoker, with generous health benefits at the taxpayers' expense. Seems to me that a pot banging, Live-Free-or-Die, God and Country First American as yourself would recoil at such socialist extravagance.
By rabblerouser (46), Hampton Bays on Mar 4, 10 12:21 PM
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I've adressed this issue before, also to a person who can't find the ability to indentify herself. In 1980 I took a Civil Service test. I scored a 97 and eventually got hired by the town. My wife, then a single mother took a civil service test in the late 80's and also was hired as a Police Dispatcher, working around the clock, raising her kids. My step daughter applied for and got a job with the Highway department a few years ago, as she already had a Class B license, she was an attractive candidte ...more
By Terry (380), Southampton on Mar 7, 10 5:13 PM
With all due respect PeopleFIrst, you are the one who referenced the stimulus bill. You cannot honestly do so without invoking it's creators - Obama, Reid and Pelosi. Further it is Ms. Flemming and her campaign who has sought to attach herself at the hip to every Democrat politican of use, including Congressman Bishop, with whom there is no daylight between him and the other three. Thats called trying to have your cake and eat it too.
By DJII13 (155), Hampton Bays on Mar 3, 10 10:48 AM
After reading most of the comments here posted ostensibly by supporters of one "side" or the other, I am inclined to vote for:

"None of the above."

What happened to kindly, informed and intelligent debate on the factual issues amongst gentle people?
By PBR (4956), Southampton on Mar 3, 10 12:38 PM
1 member liked this comment
Why don't you provide some?
By fcmcmann (417), Hampton Bays on Mar 3, 10 12:46 PM
- - or, the candidate who made her first appearance in '60s San Francisco, "Nun of the Above".
By highhatsize (4217), East Quogue on Mar 3, 10 4:04 PM
Just when and where was that kindly, inforemed intelligetn debate on factual issues?

I must have missed it.
By Terry (380), Southampton on Mar 7, 10 5:05 PM
I feel like a hall monitor here, trying to get the kids back into the classroom. Back on topic (once more), which topic is the coming special election, we've got a smart, dedicated lawyer with a splendid record (Bridget Fleming), against a strong, high-ranking police officer, also with a splendid record (Bill Hughes). There are other similarities between these two honorable citizens who want to serve on our Town Board.
There are also differences. For one, electing Bill Hughes will mean a ...more
By Turkey Bridge (1979), Quiogue on Mar 3, 10 2:51 PM
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Turkey Bridge, your double twist back flip of saying you are only going positive by saying you are not going to repeat your previous negative post only to do, is as convoluted as most of Ms. Flemmings answers during the debates. Most of which included some variation of hearing new voices. Last I checked you democrats didn't have any problem commandeering the microphone at town hall, the letters to the editor page of the press, or room on the blogs.
By DJII13 (155), Hampton Bays on Mar 3, 10 2:58 PM
DJ, you lost me with that last one, but it's OK, really. The last time I checked, the Town Hall microphone, the Press letters page, and the blogs are all free territory in a free country, so if you want some space, go get it, knock yourself out. If what you say when you do it is as mixed up as what you just said here, hey, fine with me.
Seriously, though, if you're suggesting that those who think differently from you should just go to Town Board meetings and speak into the microphone, let ...more
By fidelis (199), westhampton beach on Mar 3, 10 4:35 PM
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Travesty? There are 43 people in the town who know what a "sustainablilty cordinator" is. I think it's something like a "commumity organizer" isn't it? Go ahead, go to 7-11 in the AM and ask 20 people in a row what that job title refers to.
Most people don't want the Town Board to do anything beyond balancing the books, paying the bills, and providing for those functions mandated by the state. Its that simple. They don't want or expect Town Hall to be the instigator of social change.
By Terry (380), Southampton on Mar 3, 10 6:14 PM
If they don't know it is not a reflection on the position but the apathetic nature of most residents. There are those of us who do know what it is and support having one.
By yearrounder (208), Southampton on Mar 3, 10 7:38 PM

Terry, "community organizer"? 20 people in a row at 7/11? Regarding a sustainability coordinator? Another one of your out of context remarks. Tsk, tsk, that sounds crypto-racist. Totally out of place in this forum where an open exchange of ideas should be the norm, not a venue for gratuitous insults and intolerance.

You ought to be ashamed of yourself!
By Observant (14), southampton on Mar 3, 10 7:52 PM

Terry, "community organizer"? 20 people in a row at 7/11? Regarding a sustainability coordinator? Another one of your out of context remarks. Tsk, tsk, that sounds crypto-racist. Totally out of place in this forum where an open exchange of ideas should be the norm, not a venue for gratuitous insults and intolerance.

You ought to be ashamed of yourself!
By Observant (14), southampton on Mar 3, 10 7:52 PM
What the *$@! are you talking about??? How do you get crypto-racist from Terry's post? Because he used....7-11.?? Please explain.
By Bayman1 (297), Sag Harbor on Mar 4, 10 7:32 AM
Your claims of racism are misplaced and shameful. If you do not agree with Terry than state why, don't make false accusations or character assassinations. Disgusting tactic used by those who cannot hold their own in an arguement with substance.
By AlwaysLocal (292), southampton on Mar 6, 10 7:21 AM
Terry, I'll give you a pass on the racist thing. Given your generally responsible (however misguided) comments all along, I'm prepared to assume that you didn't intend any slur with the 7-11 reference.

But really, it doesn't prove anything that 20 randomly selected citizens would be ignorant of what a Sustainability Coordinator does. Hey, I'm a political junkie, and I didn't know what it was until this thing blew up. People might not know what a cryptographer is, either, but they're ...more
By fidelis (199), westhampton beach on Mar 3, 10 9:23 PM

Fidelis, if you are a political junkie, you should know that in the ultra right wing parlance, "Community organizer" are code words for undeserving African Americans getting undeserved, wasteful, government dole outs for non-productive jobs organizing non productive people. The extreme right wing blogosphere is teeming with these references.

These code words were used with terrifying frequency about Obama during the last elections. You couple that remark with senseless " 20 people ...more
By Observant (14), southampton on Mar 3, 10 9:38 PM
This subject is not about race, why must you continue to interject such a horrible accusation into this debate. This has NOTHING to do with race, so quit beating that drum, it makes you sound ignorant. If you want to argue about racism, find another venue, this stream is about an election.
By AlwaysLocal (292), southampton on Mar 6, 10 7:30 AM
Thank You fidelis for your pass.
Observant (who isn't) you are out of line and you darn well know it. If it makes you feel better, poll 20 soccer moms or dads as they drop the kids off at school this morning. Why would I suggest polling 20 day laborers in regards to this issue? I dont know anything about code words, but does not the President of the United States claim that he was a "community organizer" on his resume'? If you want to take that as some sort of a "right wing" slur, go ahead. ...more
By Terry (380), Southampton on Mar 4, 10 8:11 AM
Fidelis you state it has been "established that the sustainabilty coordinator will create jobs". I think that is just a fuzzy feel good "claim". But in the spirit of debate, please educate me (and presumeably others) as to how the a sustainabilty coordinator creates private sector jobs, beyond additional layers of bureacracy and other governmnet makework. Please feel free to also weigh in how this will compare to the experience in Spain which had the largest push of any western nation to create ...more
By DJII13 (155), Hampton Bays on Mar 4, 10 9:15 AM
DJ, go ahead and educate yourself by reading the minutes and/or viewing the TV film of the 2/23 Town Board meeting at which this was debated. It's all spelled out there, and also in the proceedings of the Southampton Sustainability Committee.
As part of your education, please reconsider a position you've taken several times above, which is that public sector jobs don't count as job creation for this purpose. You've repeated it in your most recent post, wanting to know about "private sector ...more
By fidelis (199), westhampton beach on Mar 4, 10 10:44 AM
OK, just this morning, the Southampton Press endorsed Bridget Fleming over Bill Hughes for Town Board, saying she would "provide a counterbalance on a board leaning hard to the right", and that "Ms. Fleming's focus is on creating jobs, and she has already taken steps to meet with officials at the state and national levels to talk about what can be done." Good pick.
The letters in today's Press are 7-to-2 in favor of Bridget Fleming. I'm counting Dorothy Reilly's letter in the Fleming column ...more
By Turkey Bridge (1979), Quiogue on Mar 4, 10 12:16 PM
I always believed it was the policy of the Press not to print pro or con letters in the edition prior to an election.
By Terry (380), Southampton on Mar 4, 10 6:02 PM
Pro yes, con no. Their policy for the last issue before an election is not to print letters attacking a candidate, but they will and do print positive letters in favor of a candidate. Those are the nine letters to which I'm referring, seven of which favor Ms. Fleming.
By Turkey Bridge (1979), Quiogue on Mar 6, 10 9:31 PM
Today's Press also has an ad from the Southampton Town PBA endorsing Ms. Fleming (page A22 -- lower left corner).

I won't fan the flames here, but Mr. Hughes is not portrayed all that well IMO.

Judge for yourself by reading the ad.

By PBR (4956), Southampton on Mar 4, 10 12:45 PM
OK Fidelis. I did listen to the town board meeting minutes and discussion on the issue. As I suspected there was nothing offered specifically on how the sustainabilty coordinator would create jobs unless you accpet the proposition that money will not be spent on energy home improvement without such a person. This of course flies in the face of the fact that home improvement industry is one of the largest industries on Long Island.
I did however hear that according to one person that hiring a ...more
By DJII13 (155), Hampton Bays on Mar 4, 10 1:38 PM
DJ, I guess it's sort of a glass is half-empty/glass is half full sort of thing. By that I mean you looked at the energy home improvement part and took it to mean money won't be spent without this person being in place, while I took it to mean substantially more money will be spent if this person is in place, thus adding to the revenues of the home improvement industry and creating jobs or keeping jobs that otherwise would have been lost. We're looking at the same data and drawing different conclusions, ...more
By fidelis (199), westhampton beach on Mar 4, 10 3:00 PM
Fidelis I am only going on what was actually said, based on your assertion that it was "established" the coordinator would create jobs. That quote was the only thing remotely beyond the general unsubstantiated assertion of job creation. Far from established, it was a hollow feel good talking point.
Sorry, the idea that government can realistically make this happen is belied by the fact that less than 5% of the stimulus money set aside for this particular endeavor has been actualized, despite ...more
By DJII13 (155), Hampton Bays on Mar 4, 10 3:33 PM
"Free lunch, Free lunch, Free Lunch" Would you stop already?! GRANT MONEY.
By yearrounder (208), Southampton on Mar 4, 10 5:11 PM
Grant money from a stimulus bill funded by our tax dollars and those borrowed from the Chinese that by definition was meant to be temporary. And it came with the worry that left in the hands of Pelosi and Reid to design, it would be used to grow government at the local and state level by creating programs and government jobs that we would be left to pay for after the stimulus was gone. This is an almost picture perfect case in point.
By DJII13 (155), Hampton Bays on Mar 4, 10 5:54 PM
The money was to save the freaking economy from the brink of collapse! Don't you get that, or are you only concerned about yourself? The best economists in the country have credit the stimulus with creating hundreds of thousands of jobs and pulling us back from the brink of a depression! You can tell all the lies and mistruths you like, but the truth speaks louder.

Where the heck were you and those like you when the republican put us into this mess with deregulation and tax cuts to ...more
By yearrounder (208), Southampton on Mar 4, 10 6:13 PM
I believe you're wrong on two points, DJ:
1. I'll accept that "established" was too strong a word to use for the prospect of job creation resulting from the installation of a sustainability coordinator, but your characterization of it as "a hollow feel-good talking point" goes too far in the other direction. I submit that it's as I suggested above, that it presents a reasonable chance of job creation, and we should go for it, especially since it's a free lunch.
2. I used that term to ...more
By fidelis (199), westhampton beach on Mar 4, 10 6:29 PM
By the way, I see that the Southampton Press has endorsed Bridget Fleming, as have so many others. The Press didn't mention the sustainability issue in its endorsement, but they did call her "the more analytical candidate, the one more attuned to the big picture". One thing I'll bet is that Bridget Fleming, and my friends DJ and Terry, have a much better understanding of the sustainability question than Bill Hughes does.
By fidelis (199), westhampton beach on Mar 4, 10 6:38 PM
1 member liked this comment
See Fidelis you would be wrong about that. Dollars to donuts Mr. Hughes is the only one of me, you, Terry and Ms. Flemming (and for that matter must of the sustainabilty advocates) whose house includes solar panels, and he didn't need a sustainabilty coordinator to make it happen. I think that is called putting his money where his mouth is. But I know that is just a fact that threatens to get inthe way of the opinion of others. (of course if your house is solar powered I willfully stand corrected ...more
By DJII13 (155), Hampton Bays on Mar 4, 10 7:14 PM
No, the stimulus created the jobs, not tarp. Your argument re: Hughes' solar panels is hands down the most inane comment I have ever read on these boards! Laughable and frightening at the same time! I'll make a deal with you, you cut the teabagging and I'll cut the caffeine.
By yearrounder (208), Southampton on Mar 4, 10 8:12 PM
The Republicans currently have 60% of the town board. Do they really need an 80% supermajority.
So DJ, Terry or whoever, please tell us why the Republicans need 80% of the control over Southampton town when they make up only 23 % of the population?
By SHNative (554), Southampton on Mar 4, 10 7:59 PM
I am sure you do not mean to come off sounding that uneducated yearrounder, but you said the stimulus saved the economy and by creating jobs. Pre-stimulus unemployment was at 8%, now its 10+%.
My point on the solar panels was simple, Fidelis incorrectly asserted the Mr. Hughes knew less about sustainabilty than others, yet he was a local pioneer in powering his house with solar well before it became fashionable to be green.
By DJII13 (155), Hampton Bays on Mar 4, 10 8:19 PM
BTW yearounder, given what actual common use defintion of teabagging is, I wouldn't continue to suggest that I am teabagging you and am a little surpised the editors are letting that inappropriate comment stand.
By DJII13 (155), Hampton Bays on Mar 4, 10 8:30 PM
Firstly, "teabagging" and "teabagger" were phrases coined by members of the tea party community, of which you are clearly a card-carrying member. Secondly, you are "teabagging" in the sense that you are spewing nonsensical, hypocritical, far-right talking points ala the "tea party" movement. Man you conservatives are such whiners.
By yearrounder (208), Southampton on Mar 5, 10 10:00 AM
The term "teabagger" was not coined by those within the movement, it was started by Keith Olberman (and soon after, Rachel Maddow) of MSNBC. It was used as an insult, suggesting the sexual explicities of the act. This was done to offend the TEA PARTIERS (yes, that is the proper term) and has caught on in media circles who do not share the same political views.
By AlwaysLocal (292), southampton on Mar 7, 10 12:30 AM

DJII13: "I am sure you do not mean to come off sounding that uneducated yearrounder, but you said the stimulus saved the economy and by creating jobs. Pre-stimulus unemployment was at 8%, now its 10+%"..

I have a BA and Masters in Economics, with my thesis on Business Cycles and took doctorate level courses in Macroeconomics. And I assure you it is not yearrounder who sounds uneducated. You misinterpret Macroeconomics and are repeating Fox News right wing talking points.

This ...more
By Common Sense (56), Southampton on Mar 4, 10 11:57 PM

Sorry for the typo. The economy for the quarter ended December 2009 grew a whopping 5.9%, not 2.9%, the highest in 6 years, after almost 2 years of the worst Recession (from Dec 2007) since the Great Depression, due to 7 years of moronic economic policies..
By Common Sense (56), Southampton on Mar 5, 10 12:05 AM
And of course commomsense being as degreed as you are you do know that most of that growth in GDP in Q4 was a result of busineeses refilling depleted inventory which is a part of the natural cylcles of an up and down economy and almost completerly unelated to the stimulus. But again folks don't let facts get inthe way of your opinion.
We don't even need to get to how Barney "I am willing to roll the dice" Frank approach to the housing market contributed mightily to the economic meltdown or ...more
By DJII13 (155), Hampton Bays on Mar 5, 10 6:44 AM
Hey, DJ, hate to get involved in someone else's argument, but the stimulus save and created nearly 2 million jobs. Yes, unemployment went up, but it could have gotten much worse. Under Bush we were losing tens of thousands of jobs a month and that accounted for the increase and Obama slowed that loss considerably. You forget where we were when our current president took office - conveniently.

Your point on solar panels was puerile and pointless and reeks of desperation. Besides, if Mr. ...more
By peoplefirst (787), Southampton on Mar 5, 10 9:56 AM
Hey PeopleFirst -
No desperation here, just a simple counter point to your buddy Fidelis' incorrect arguement that Mr. Hughes did not know about sustainability. The fact of the matter remains (no matter how you disparage it) that Mr. Hugheswas using Solar Power for his home probably before your candidate even lived here.
And whose to say, that he is not in favor of tax incentives for others? That is just pure negative campagining on your part without any basis in fact.
By DJII13 (155), Hampton Bays on Mar 5, 10 10:25 AM
DJ, I wouldn't beat up on your solar panel argument with the language that peoplefirst uses, but he's got a point about Mr. Hughes -- if he has solar panels himself, why wouldn't he want to help others get them? Another thing is that just owning solar panels doesn't confer understanding of sustainability matters in government, which is what we were discussing. I own a house, but I don't know beans about mortgage derivatives.
By fidelis (199), westhampton beach on Mar 5, 10 11:26 AM
Oh, incidentally, did I mention that the Southampton Press endorsed Bridget Fleming over Bill Hughes? I guess I did. Oh well, getting old, I suppose.
By fidelis (199), westhampton beach on Mar 5, 10 11:33 AM
You may want to look into their track record, over the last 10 years or so. Their endorsement is quite often the kiss of death.
By Terry (380), Southampton on Mar 5, 10 1:16 PM
Like I said to peoplefirst, Fidelis, what possible basis do you have to draw the conclusion that Mr. Hughes would not want to help others go solar....none as usual! You are the one who challenged his bona fides on sustainabilty and I d merely pointed out that it doesn't take a whole lot of common sense to know that someone with foresight to go solar way before it was popular, knows more abut sustainabilty than you were willing to give him credit for as usual. This is one you ought to fess up to ...more
By DJII13 (155), Hampton Bays on Mar 5, 10 11:44 AM
Yes it is getting old FIdelis unless you also note that the Southampton Press noted of Ms. Flemming that she did not make a compelling case for election, and drew dissapointing blanks on various important issues.
That must be very dissapointing for a second time around candidate who was hand picked by the Democrat establishment led by Congressman Bishop
By DJII13 (155), Hampton Bays on Mar 5, 10 11:48 AM
1 member liked this comment
What a nightmarish election. The STPD PBA endorses another Democratic poodle and the Republican candidate is a cop! KA-CHING!
By highhatsize (4217), East Quogue on Mar 5, 10 1:01 PM
1 member liked this comment
By yearrounder (208), Southampton on Mar 5, 10 4:29 PM
The Press got it right. A little more balance on the board.
By EastEnd68 (888), Westhampton on Mar 5, 10 1:27 PM
The Republicans currently have 60% of the town board. Do they really need an 80% supermajority.
So DJ, Terry or whoever, please tell us why the Republicans need 80% of the control over Southampton town when they make up only 23 % of the population?

By SHNative (554), Southampton on Mar 5, 10 1:37 PM
I don't know where you got the 23% number from, but this is what I found from the 2007 census
Southampton Town
Republican - 48.521%
Democrats - 49.460%
By reg rep (408), Southampton on Mar 5, 10 6:17 PM
In my opinion the SHPBA endorsed Flemming because of ATH, they endorsed her and over donated to her campaign in Nov. I'm sure they think they stand a better change to get whatever they want should Flemming win.
Also, don't forget the PBA sued the Superiors Officers Union because they separated from the PBA. The negitive1/4 page ad the PBA paid for (I think) was payback. Bill Hughes was part of the Superiors Officers Union, no love there between them. We are so much better off with Bill Hughes ...more
By reg rep (408), Southampton on Mar 5, 10 6:28 PM
Reg Rep
61,000 people live yearround in Southampton Town, 14,000 Gop
23% of the town population are, like yourself, registered Republicans.
Yet, you want 80% of the representation on the town board. that is plain wrong!
I will be voting for Bridget Fleming......we need balance.
By SHNative (554), Southampton on Mar 5, 10 8:01 PM
This just in: The Independent newspaper has endorsed Bridget Fleming, too. They can't all be wrong.
By fidelis (199), westhampton beach on Mar 5, 10 9:33 PM
And the Independent said of Ms. Flemming - "she tends to speak in platitiudes that sound good but are sometimes just wrong"....again not to confuse anyones opinion with a fact but......
By DJII13 (155), Hampton Bays on Mar 5, 10 9:56 PM
2 members liked this comment
DJ, we expect better of you than out-of-context spin. The Independent followed this observation with: "That said, there is much to like about Fleming: she's obviously extremely bright, she honestly cares about the community, and she is a hard worker", and later, "Our endorsement goes to Bridget Fleming, who will help balance the board". Bottom line, they endorsed her over Bill Hughes. You can pick and twist this all you want, in fact I welcome it, because each time you do, I'll have reason ...more
By fidelis (199), westhampton beach on Mar 6, 10 9:16 PM
Why would anyone be surprised that DJ takes a Glen Beck approach to citing another source .
By yearrounder (208), Southampton on Mar 7, 10 6:35 PM
SHNative, while I do not agree with regreps math yours is far worse and based on your previous posts, I believe intentionally so. CommonSense the degreed eceonomist would tell you, if she was willing to be an honest poster, that you cannot divide the number of registered Republicans by the total population to come up with a percentage like you have, because the total population is not registered. But again, let me not confuse a fact with your opinions.
By DJII13 (155), Hampton Bays on Mar 5, 10 10:05 PM
Ms. Fleming,

With-such-a-close association with, Democrats Steve Levy, Deputy Executive, Ben Zwirn, and Supervisor Throne-Holst, the latter, Ms. Throne-Holst, Democrat, doing absolutely nothing towards the solution of the Sex Offender Trailer problem, and not once speaking out against Mr. Levy’s anti Southampton policies. Mr. Levy, and Benny Zwirn, both Democrats, a party supporting you, while being the boss architects for the permanent installation of the Homeless Sex Offender Trailers ...more
By fazool (22), Southampton on Mar 5, 10 11:42 PM
I will support the candidate who will pledge to make public the actual expenditure in salaries and overtime for the STPD. At the moment, we only have prospective data on annual salary costs without overtime. If we were able to read the actual cost per pd rank for 2009 as we are now able to read the prospective salaries for 2010 on the town website, we would have a clear picture of the true cost. The public data we have,even though showing stunningly high salaries, is misleadingly low.

By highhatsize (4217), East Quogue on Mar 6, 10 10:09 PM
I will support the candidate who will pledge to make public the actual expenditure in salaries and overtime for the STPD. At the moment, we only have prospective data on annual salary costs without overtime. If we were able to read the actual cost per pd rank for 2009 as we are now able to read the prospective salaries for 2010 on the town website, we would have a clear picture of the true cost. The public data we have,even though showing stunningly high salaries, is misleadingly low.

By highhatsize (4217), East Quogue on Mar 6, 10 10:09 PM
Why don't you just FOIL it?
By Terry (380), Southampton on Mar 7, 10 7:36 AM
If he were to FOIL it that would give him an answer, which is not expedient when you are trying to make the case the that the department from which you are FOILing information is somehow trying to hide information. It would go against highhatsize's notion of town government and town police conspiring against the public. An absence of information is actually beneficial in this situation, even if it is easily attainable.
By Bayman1 (297), Sag Harbor on Mar 7, 10 12:05 PM
The police dept is not a serious issue-they get paid what they get paid and they deserve the overtime. Good pay for a job well done.
By EastEnd68 (888), Westhampton on Mar 7, 10 1:34 PM
to Terry & Bayman1:

Frankly, were I to submit a FOIL for this information, if, indeed, the Town Council has even compiled it, I would have to identify myself. Considering my opinion of the STPD, this would be foolhardy.

However, Bayman1 or Terry, either of you from the STPD chorus could file the request with little danger. Do so, and prove my ignorance.
By highhatsize (4217), East Quogue on Mar 7, 10 1:40 PM
You prove your ignorance quite well on your own.
By Terry (380), Southampton on Mar 7, 10 5:14 PM
1 member liked this comment
No highhatsize, you don't have to identify yourself when submitting a FOIL request, however you do have to put a name on the form, i.e. John Smith, Mickey Mouse, Simon Bolivar, Wyatt Erp, whatever.... So that argument holds no water. If you are so concerned that someone may recognize you, I am sure you could send an emissary on your behalf.
As to your second question; why would I go through the effort of getting supporting documentation for that which I already believe to be true?

By Bayman1 (297), Sag Harbor on Mar 7, 10 3:16 PM
to Bayman1:

You are wrong, again. The only way to avoid putting my real name on a FOIL would be to hire an attorney. I won't spend the money. Furthermore, any emissary that I might ask to file in my place would put himself directly in the sights of the STPD.

There is nothing to prevent you, however, from filing and thus receiving documentary proof of your naked assertion. Since it was your STPD chorus colleague who suggested this recourse, I am surprised that you don't jump ...more
By highhatsize (4217), East Quogue on Mar 7, 10 3:32 PM
You, my friend, are wrong. I have very recently filed a successful FOIL request in the southampton town clerk's office, without any form of ID whatsoever. Which, by the way is the same location that one would request the information in question. How this would put you or anyone else "in the sights of the STPD" I have no idea. Perhaps the employees in the town clerk's office are a part of the grand conspiracy as well?
As for me requesting further documentation of that which ...more
By Bayman1 (297), Sag Harbor on Mar 7, 10 8:12 PM
to Bayman1:

To whom will the FOIL report you requested be delivered, if not yourself? Did you file it anonymously, (for instance, as you suggested, as "Mickey Mouse")? If the answer to the latter question is, "Yes", then I stand corrected. Regardless, you still appear on video making the request. Moreover, anyone who makes a request for information that would adversely affect the STPD will be remembered by the Town Clerks office. Everybody in Town Hall knows everything about anything ...more
By highhatsize (4217), East Quogue on Mar 8, 10 3:34 AM
So it seems my suggestion that you think that the employees in the town clerk's office are part of the grand conspiracy is correct. I can't do anything to help you other than make suggestions.
The twenty year retirement section for the town code is taken directly from section 384-d(m) of the NYS Retirement Law, which I told you. If you did not bother to look it up that is your business. You seemed to hang your hat on "the police being hired under contracts that say they will ...more
By Bayman1 (297), Sag Harbor on Mar 8, 10 8:00 AM
to Bayman1:

The dissemination of information in Town Hall is more a result of gossip than of malice, which, however, does not stop those of malicious intent from using the information against the innocent.

Thank you for the courtesy of posting the relevant NYS civil service retirement law section. The signal language in that section is, " each member
of such department shall be separated from service upon completion of
twenty years of service, provided, however, that the ...more
By highhatsize (4217), East Quogue on Mar 8, 10 3:17 PM
In order to come up with the figure you are looking for, you look at what was budgeted, i.e. the figure on the town's website, and compare it against the figure on seethroughny.net, that will give you the actual figure. What is so difficult to figure out? Please tell me what part I am missing if that is not what you are looking for.

You probably left out the rest of the NYS Retirement Law statute by accident so I have provided it below:
provided, however, that the ...more
By Bayman1 (297), Sag Harbor on Mar 8, 10 6:09 PM
to Bayman1:

The seethroughny.net site has historical data for police salaries in 2009.

The Town website publishes the proposed salaries for the 2010 budget.

There is no way to access the proposed base salaries for 2009. That information does not appear on the Town website, (nor on seethroughny).

There is also the problem that seethroughny.net requires the name and pay grade of the individual for whom you are seeking information whereas the Town website information ...more
By highhatsize (4217), East Quogue on Mar 8, 10 7:21 PM
Base salaries for 2009 will be the same as for 2008, because the contract which expired dec. 31 2008 is still unsettled. Base pay and then overtime plus base pay will obviously be different for each officer because they all are at different steps and or ranks. What you want sounds like a lot of work, I certainly don't have what you are looking for. I will make an educated guess and say no southampton police officer has made six figures in overtime alone. That would be a tremendous ...more
By Bayman1 (297), Sag Harbor on Mar 8, 10 7:56 PM
When Southampton Town and most of the local municipalities in this country are forced to declare bankruptcy over the next few years, you can all get the payroll figures from the bankruptcy court. Payrolls, benefits, retirement packages, etc. are WAY over the top IMO, all while local municipal revenues are declining. The curves WILL cross.

It is probably going to get worse. Pensions will be wiped out due to past excessive union demands and overtime.

Back-peddle to see The Big PIcture.

Fasten ...more
By PBR (4956), Southampton on Mar 8, 10 7:57 PM
to Bayman1:

I thought that you were critical of my supposition that the true annual cost of the
STPD is hundreds of thousands of dollars more than appears on the proposed budget because overtime doesn't appear on the proposed budget. I AM ignorant of overtime costs because I cannot find any publicly available budget figures showing it. Hence, I thought that if you had access to a budget statement that showed overtime, you would have posted it to make the point that I was mistaken.

My ...more
By highhatsize (4217), East Quogue on Mar 8, 10 8:27 PM
I don't know what the overtime cost is in the STPD annual budget, nor do I have access to it. I would look on the town's website like I suspect you would. It could be obtained, probably very easily, I would think, it is a public record. I would also think that the department as a whole would have an overtime budget easily in the six figure range; 100 officers multiplied by $1000 gives you $100,000. Each member needs to make $1000 in overtime for you to right. If I understand you ...more
By Bayman1 (297), Sag Harbor on Mar 8, 10 8:39 PM
It sounds as though many would appreciate something other than politics as usual. Also someone being endorsed by "Alphabet Soup" does not necessarily guarantee a good candidate. I have been to two of the debates and saw one of them on TV. I very much appreciated direct answers. So tomorrow I am proudly casting my vote for Bill Hughes. See you all there!!!!
By RonM (8), Hampton Bays on Mar 8, 10 10:13 PM
If you want a change from politics as usual, vote for Bridget Fleming, who isn't from the same old crowd that has been running our town into the ground. Bill Hughes does give direct answers, but they're often the wrong answers. What might seem like indirect answers from Ms. Fleming are actually an honest expression of the fact that many local issues are complicated and don't lend themselves to simple Sesame Street answers.
By Turkey Bridge (1979), Quiogue on Mar 9, 10 10:42 AM
Talk about talking points bable.
By Terry (380), Southampton on Mar 9, 10 11:30 AM
One definition of existentialism is the belief that we exist in a reality in which we are compelled to act without knowing why or how. That makes this election perfectly existential.

Both Bridget Fleming and William Hughes are upstanding citizens with a zeal for public service according to their puff pieces published in this paper but both have proffered only the vaguest of plans to address the budget deficit which both agree is the most important problem facing the Town.

So, ...more
By highhatsize (4217), East Quogue on Mar 9, 10 1:57 AM
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It's all over now!! The better candidate won inspite of your inane blogs!! Go back to being a cop Mr. Hughes!!
By bayview (160), Southampton on Mar 10, 10 8:09 AM