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Story - News

Jan 5, 2014 11:09 AMPublication: The Southampton Press

UPDATE: Driver In Fatal Crash Pleads Not Guilty To DWI, Held On $250,000 Bail

Jan 6, 2014 4:32 PM

UPDATE: Monday, 2:45 p.m.

The driver who police say drunkenly hit and killed a 56-year-old Middle Island woman with his car Sunday morning pleaded not guilty to one misdemeanor charge of DWI in Southampton Town Justice Court on Monday, according to a court spokeswoman.

Joseph Perez, 31, of Aquebogue was arraigned on one count of DWI along with one count of failing to maintain his lane, a violation, which he also pleaded not guilty to. He is being held in Suffolk County Jail in Riverside on $250,000 cash bail or $500,000 bond.

Police allege that Mr. Perez hit Donna Sartori with his pick-up truck at 4:24 a.m. Sunday as she was delivering newspapers on Main Street in Hampton Bays. He has not been formally charged in relation to Ms. Sartori's death.

A grand jury will convene and examine the evidence in the case to determine if Mr. Perez will face any additional charges, according to District Attorney Thomas Spota's office.

ORIGINAL STORY:

A 31-year-old Aquebogue man, who police said was driving drunk, struck and killed a woman on Main Street in Hampton Bays early Sunday morning while she was delivering newspapers, according to a press release sent out by Southampton Town Police Detective Sergeant Lisa Costa.

The woman, Donna Sartori, 56, of Middle Island, was standing by her parked car on Montauk Highway, west of Ponquogue Avenue, when Joseph Perez struck another parked car and then hit hers with his 2001 Ford pick-up truck at 4:24 a.m.

Southampton Town Police, the New York State Police Forensic ID and Collision Reconstruction Unit, and the Hampton Bays Fire Department responded to the scene.

Ms. Sartori was pronounced dead at the scene.

Mr. Perez was transported to Peconic Bay Medical Center for non-life threatening injuries and later charged with DWI.

Det. Sgt. Costa said the investigation is ongoing and that anyone who may have information about the crash contact the Southampton Town Detectives at 702-2230 or call anonymously to Crime Stoppers at 1-800-220-TIPS.

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May all prayers be for this woman and her family. Working to get newspapers to the various vendors in the cold weather only to be killed by an irresponsible drunk driver, what a horrible tragedy. The law needs to come down hard on this man. Too many drunks driving around in the Hamptons. Where are the lawmakers?
By JimmyKBond (156), Hampton Bays on Jan 5, 14 11:40 AM
Just out of curiosity, what would you have the "lawmakers" do that they haven't done yet?
By But I'm a blank! (1283), Hampton Bays on Jan 6, 14 11:24 AM
1 member liked this comment
Too many drunks on the road everywhere. Now add pot to the mix in those states making it legal and being out and about becomes more dangerous then ever.
By John GORMAN (4), Hampton Bays on Jan 5, 14 12:08 PM
1 member liked this comment
It is not the substance which should be put to question, it is the substance of the person which should be put to question.

Blaming alcohol or cannabis is a coward's way. Blaming the person makes more sense, but rational behavior has never been humanity's strong point.
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Jan 5, 14 1:25 PM
Well said Z.
By dnice (2346), Hampton Bays on Jan 5, 14 9:40 PM
3 members liked this comment
Thanks for the morale!

These days I could use a bit...
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Jan 5, 14 11:13 PM
You don't think that the legalization of pot makes it more available and easily obtainable, do you?

Mr. Gorman, I can go out right now and find some with no problem. How much better off would we be if a portion of the purchase price were taxes to the state? Legalization has no effect on availability, or misuse by anyone.
By But I'm a blank! (1283), Hampton Bays on Jan 7, 14 1:23 PM
2 members liked this comment
What legalization does do is remove the money flowing into the black market fueling our miserable failure called "The Drug War".
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Jan 7, 14 10:56 PM
This is such a tragedy.Our prayers go out to her and her family. She was a special person in my sons life. Being childless she took my son under her wing at work mentored him as well as supported his dreams. She never went a day without talking with him about Life, working hard to achieve what you want and the goodness in people. My 20 year old son has lost a great friend due to the irresponsibility of another, THROW THE BOOK AT HIM.
By maxwell (169), speonk on Jan 5, 14 12:51 PM
3 members liked this comment
Some questions that everyone reading this story would like answered:

Is Mr. Perez an undocumented alien?

Was his pickup truck disabled?

Does he have a criminal record? (Another publication implies that he does.)

Answers to these questions may perpetuate a negative stereotype and their proposal may indicate a prejudicial preconception but their answer is NEWS.
By highhatsize (4217), East Quogue on Jan 5, 14 1:47 PM
1 member liked this comment
how do we know you not an illegal alien from another planet?
By mo (89), Sag Harbor on Jan 5, 14 11:59 PM
The person would usually not be that way, if it weren't for the substance. That's why people have applied to have their convictions overturned, because they were under the influence of the substance. It's about the substance and the use of the substance.
By harbor hound (31), southampton on Jan 5, 14 3:06 PM
2 members liked this comment
say what?
By CaptainSig (716), Dutch Harbor on Jan 5, 14 4:22 PM
1 member liked this comment
What I think we mean to say is it comes down to you.

The reckless harm others. The disciplined do not.
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Jan 5, 14 11:03 PM
Most people would usually not be that way if the substance was in another person's stomach and not the person who decided to ingest said substance & then drive a very large & heavy machine on icy, slushy roads. Of course nobody is their usual sober self when under the influence. That is a truism & not any legal defense. Nobody is tried for a crime because they were not the "usual person" who would not commit the crime if they were the other person with a different stomach.
By mo (89), Sag Harbor on Jan 6, 14 12:11 AM
I live right down the road on Suffolk Road and was taking a walk downtown.The collision was right across the street rom me and I saw it all.The crash was horrible.I thought that it was probably just another hispanic guy without a license.Wow !
By mrkymrk1956 (2), hampton bays on Jan 5, 14 4:12 PM
Just yesterday people were complaining about being delayed by a traffic stop by police looking for drunks drivers at 130 in the morning. Do the idiots that complained now understand why we have traffic stops after midnight.
By jim (48), hampton bays on Jan 5, 14 8:05 PM
3 members liked this comment
Jim, those traffic stops didn't stop this tragedy from happening did they? While we are at it, why don't we have stops every night on every road? Give me a break.
By dnice (2346), Hampton Bays on Jan 5, 14 9:44 PM
2 members liked this comment
Why don't we next have a cop in every back seat to give a driver a sobriety test before they could start the engine? You certainly deserve a break.
By mo (89), Sag Harbor on Jan 6, 14 12:16 AM
1 member liked this comment
No it didn't stop this tragedy, but the check points have stopped tragedies. The problem is people are too stupid to think about the consequences of their actions! Sometimes people need to be reminded DON'T DRINK AND DRIVE with checkpoints.
By Terbear (77), Southampton on Jan 6, 14 6:21 PM
Probably someone with no insurance and an unregistered car. Just saw a car last week with a foreign plate on front and a North Carolina one in front. Didn't know North Carolina was in a foreign country. He's probably undocumented also, so the police cant do anything. Its time for Hampton Bays and the east end to crack down on these accidents.
By longislander40 (37), hampton bays on Jan 5, 14 8:19 PM
It is time to crack down on illegals, period.
By dnice (2346), Hampton Bays on Jan 5, 14 9:45 PM
Mr Z thinks it is cowards who blame drunk drivers? Alcohol, and drugs are a huge problem in this country, and too give into this type of illegal behavior is cowardly. People with poor substance are the ones that abuse substance, and kill people. Its not ok to drink and drive!
By chief1 (2800), southampton on Jan 5, 14 10:17 PM
1 member liked this comment
...
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Jan 5, 14 11:01 PM
1 member liked this comment
You shine in reading comprehension, don't you, Chief?
By But I'm a blank! (1283), Hampton Bays on Jan 6, 14 10:19 AM
2 members liked this comment
He said blame the drivers, not the substance.
By Terbear (77), Southampton on Jan 6, 14 6:23 PM
I read in another publication the man was illegal and had no license. Why is that never reported here? I'm sick of non citizens taking advantage of us!
By chief1 (2800), southampton on Jan 5, 14 10:20 PM
1 member liked this comment
because The Press is a Liberal publication
By Jaws (245), Amity Island on Jan 5, 14 11:24 PM
Yes, The Press is certainly Left of center in its political stance, but it also has a higher standard of reporting news -- and I don't even know which "another publication" you're citing, only that The Press has stricter standards than does, say, an Island-wide daily or an on-line organization noted for press releases and puffery.
By Frank Wheeler (1826), Northampton on Jan 6, 14 6:18 PM
1 member liked this comment
I think another issue that should be pointed out is the time that bars are aloud to be open.Why is it that New York is the only state that I know of that allows bars to be open till four in the morning. I pretty sure this person was coming home from the night club dream.
By tunagirl84 (6), east quogue on Jan 6, 14 6:08 AM
First and foremost , my condolences to the family of the innocent victim, may God grant you peace in this time of great sadness. If the criminal is an illegal alien the info will not be seen in the Press where political correctness trumps everything else! Z Man, as someone who spends a lot of time on the road, I am surprised that you don't come down on the side of those against drunk driving. Please explain if I have misunderstood your post.
By bigfresh (4666), north sea on Jan 6, 14 8:22 AM
Yes, you have misunderstood another post IMO.

Mr. Z's point was more nuanced and subtle than a broad brush understanding permits.

Condolences to the family.
By PBR (4956), Southampton on Jan 6, 14 9:04 AM
I don't disagree with stopping intoxicated driving.

What I will say I disagree with is the witch hunt it has become. Depending on the circumstances, one mistake can cost a person a job, possibly a career, their house, and maybe even a marriage.

I disagree with turning people into pariahs.
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Jan 6, 14 2:15 PM
1 member liked this comment
When you write a story you include all the facts. Newspapers hide behind freedom of the press, but a paper like the press likes to write selective facts. I think the idea of a unlicensed driver is very pertinent to the story. Why doesn't the press write a story on how unlicensed immigrants have become a huge problem for east end cops? That would be political incorrect.
By chief1 (2800), southampton on Jan 6, 14 9:28 AM
Or the Press is acting like a responsible publication, and vetting the facts, before printing inaccurate information?

Not everyone has a hair trigger for making overly broad assumptions and judgments.

Jeez . . .

PS -- What does one's immigration status have to do with driving, except in the minds of lazy thinkers who KNOW "the truth" behind everything?
By PBR (4956), Southampton on Jan 6, 14 10:10 AM
2 members liked this comment
Thank you for KNOWING the whole truth all the time!
By PBR (4956), Southampton on Jan 6, 14 11:54 AM
And the drivers from other states with valid drivers licenses, how is their immigration status relevant?

And do you see your chain of if's, likely don't, odds are, etc.

What a load of speculative BS just so you can rant about illegal immigrants!
By PBR (4956), Southampton on Jan 6, 14 1:09 PM
PS CA, did you see Mac27's post below saying that the driver here is legal, licensed and a college grad who made a huge mistake?

Do you accept this as possible?

Could you be wrong about this driver?
By PBR (4956), Southampton on Jan 6, 14 1:11 PM
Cherry picking your facts (and state = NY) to fit your theory. You have left many unanswered questions. You may join chief1 on the Ignore list . . .

Folly on . . .
By PBR (4956), Southampton on Jan 6, 14 1:29 PM
Jim has it right. To all those that posted complaints above the sobriety checks: who really cares how you feel about you being inconvenienced. I assume you feel you were inconveienced when that fatal accident occured and the traffic was stopped for such a long time. There was a person laying dead at that scene. Your comfort is so unimportant in the big scope of things. Procedures must be followed in an accident involving a fatality. It's the law. And now another innocent person has been killed by ...more
By eastendgemini (7), southampton on Jan 6, 14 10:37 AM
1 member liked this comment
To PBR are you saying no citizenship, and no license is ok? Having no license means no driving which would of saved this ladies life.
By chief1 (2800), southampton on Jan 6, 14 10:45 AM
I will not be discussing anything with you, chief1, because you have proven on many many occasions that you are not able/willing to follow up with on-point posts about the details.

Notably, the discussions after the CR 39a accidents, about your proposed Lobster-Inn-To-Montauk Highway which could be easily built just like that, proved this clearly.

You have already summarized my post incorrectly, so why would I bother to go down the rabbit hole again?
By PBR (4956), Southampton on Jan 6, 14 11:53 AM
PS chief1 and CA, did you see the post below by Mac27?
By PBR (4956), Southampton on Jan 6, 14 11:56 AM
Of course if one does not have a license, one would never consider getting behind the wheel of a car, right?
By But I'm a blank! (1283), Hampton Bays on Jan 6, 14 11:56 AM
2 members liked this comment
Another spotlight on your thought processes, chief1.

Logic? What me worry?
By PBR (4956), Southampton on Jan 6, 14 12:10 PM
Because he has a Hispanic name that by default makes him illegal? He was born and raised here. Graduated from riverhead has a license as well as a son who is also a legal resident. Graduated college and was going to be a doctor. It is a tragedy as to what happen to that woman and my thoughts and prayers go to her family. But seriously do your research before you judge a person. I suppose because my child is mixed black and white that must mean when he grows up he is likely to steal and do drugs ...more
By msScha1199 (4), Flanders on Jan 6, 14 1:20 PM
The penalties for drunk driving are severe. The risks equally severe. Yet, people continue to do it, and do it often. You get in that car and drive, and you may as well be shooting at people. Innocent people just making their way home, to work, etc. Could be someone's grandparent, mother, child, brother. The selfishness of the act blows my mind. We need more examples of the possible horrors that come along with driving drunk? I don't think so. But isn't this too common in our society now? Driving ...more
By double standard (1506), Remsenburg on Jan 6, 14 5:13 PM
1 member liked this comment
Thanks for the clarification Z!
By bigfresh (4666), north sea on Jan 6, 14 6:17 PM
black/white/hispanic . who cares. the driver that drives druck is of no color and needs to admit to his druckedness and face the consequences.
By xtiego (698), bridgehampton on Jan 6, 14 7:56 PM
This guy is "Rolling Stoned"

Five Economic Reforms Millennials Should Be Fighting For
Guaranteed jobs, universal basic incomes, public finance and

By Jesse A. Myerson
January 3, 2014 10:00 AM ET
By Undocumented Democrat (2065), southampton on Jan 6, 14 9:07 PM
1 member liked this comment
Koch-backed political coalition, designed to shield donors, raised $400 million in 2012

By Matea Gold, Published: January 5
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Jan 6, 14 11:37 PM
Oh com on Z, even you must admit this guy Myerson is off his rocker
By joe hampton (3461), south hampton on Jan 7, 14 12:04 AM
Did you actually read it, or just parrot talking heads saying it?

My bet is the latter...
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Jan 7, 14 12:35 PM
I for one did read it and all I can say is I hope all Millennials do not feel this way... Because if they do this country is truly finished...

Off to play 19 check in with you after... But really surely this madness is not something you agree with even you cant be this blind... this is communism this guy is just looking for attention.
By joe hampton (3461), south hampton on Jan 7, 14 12:46 PM
Number one, this is an economic ****hole.
Number two, he's right about the massive amount of work our infrastructure requires, and the attention it's not receiving.
Number three, the minimum wage is a joke, and you can't live with dignity earning so little. Yes, we need incentive but the amount of groceries twenty bucks buys today versus ten years ago is nothing short of economic abuse.
Number four, Switzerland kicks our *** when it comes to next to zero corruption, fair business practices, ...more
Jan 8, 14 10:48 PM appended by Mr. Z
...after multiple assassination attempts by Stalin, President Tito replied: 'Stop sending people to kill me. We’ve already captured five of them, one of them with a bomb and another with a rifle… If you don’t stop sending killers, I’ll send one to Moscow, and I won’t have to send a second.'
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Jan 7, 14 10:48 PM
After $4M Vacation, Obama Talks Income Inequality...
By They call me (2826), southampton on Jan 8, 14 1:26 AM
$2.30 is the equivalent of $9.50 today.

You should really start your brain before putting your "mouth' in gear...
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Jan 16, 14 10:26 AM
1 member liked this comment
This poor woman's dog was with her. A 2 year old black and white Shih Tzu who bolted from the scene of the accident. The victim's relatives are desperate to find the dog. If anyone sees this little dog who answers to BamBam please call 631-721-6485. Sad.
By KevinLuss (356), SH on Jan 7, 14 8:59 AM
1 member liked this comment
This comment has been removed because it is a duplicate, off-topic or contains inappropriate content.
By Undocumented Democrat (2065), southampton on Jan 7, 14 1:03 PM
This comment has been removed because it is a duplicate, off-topic or contains inappropriate content.
By But I'm a blank! (1283), Hampton Bays on Jan 7, 14 1:19 PM
Does the victim have a spouse or children? What kind of reporting is this? The basics of journalistic facts are absent from this story.
By Zorro (66), Southampton on Jan 8, 14 1:14 AM
I read the article too Z and thought that is had to be a parody or a script from an upcoming Saturday Night Live skit. Not too surprising that you refer to our country looking like a steaming bag of ****, you obviously miss the glory days of the USSR Komrade. Capitalism works!
By bigfresh (4666), north sea on Jan 8, 14 7:18 AM
1 member liked this comment
If capitalism works so well, why is this country a wreck?

Why has capitalism had to be saved from itself twice in less than a century?

If it works SO well, why hasn't our economy recovered yet?

Are you capable of critical thought, or do you just enjoy spewing pseudopatriotic, Irving Berlin style BS from your keyboard?
Jan 8, 14 8:20 AM appended by Mr. Z
"We must make our choice. We may have democracy, or we may have wealth concentrated in the hands of a few, but we can't have both." ***** "Real success in business is to be found in achievements comparable rather with those of the artist or the scientist, of the inventor or statesman. And the joys sought in the profession of business must be like their joys and not the mere vulgar satisfaction which is experienced in the acquisition of money, in the exercise of power or in the frivolous pleasure of mere winning." ~ Louis A. Brandeis
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Jan 8, 14 8:20 AM
Obama will not be held accountable or responsible for anything. The MSM will cover for him because they agree with his ideology and agenda, and unfortunately seems to be protected criticism by his (shall we say appearance)
By Undocumented Democrat (2065), southampton on Jan 8, 14 8:27 AM
And, just for good measure:

"Through size, corporations, once merely an efficient tool employed by individuals in the conduct of private business have become an institution-an institution which has brought such concentration of economic power that so-called private corporations are sometimes able to dominate the state. The typical business corporation of the last century, owned by a small group of individuals, managed by their owners, and limited in size by their private wealth, is being ...more
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Jan 8, 14 8:35 AM
BULL****.
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Jan 8, 14 11:16 PM
3 members liked this comment
Condolences to the family of Ms. Sartori.

Peace on Earth
By PBR (4956), Southampton on Jan 8, 14 7:46 AM
1 member liked this comment
point by point Mr Z
1-This great nation is not a wreck, Despite the chilling economic effects of Obamacare and Dear Leader's inept leadership our country is doing fine. Could we be doing better? Of course, there will be hope when the current regime is out.
2- Please elaborate how CAPITALISM had to be saved, the system, not an individual company.
3- We are recovering, slowly to be sure, but recovering.

Would you prefer communism, socialism , Marxism or a dictatorship instead ...more
By bigfresh (4666), north sea on Jan 8, 14 11:24 AM
Your last sentence is like the record skipping to your default, buffoonish "I've got nothin'" response.

1. The current administration has a negligible amount of responsibility for the economic conditions of our country compared to the Reagan, Bush, Clinton, or Bush 2.0 administrations. You seem to have selective, or short term memory problems. Or, a severe case of ignorance. Bush doubled our national debt, and Reagan tripled it.

2. The "Great Depression" called for the Glass-Steagall ...more
Jan 8, 14 11:14 PM appended by Mr. Z
"...a common mistake that people make when trying to design something completely foolproof is to underestimate the ingenuity of complete fools." ~ Douglas Adams
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Jan 8, 14 11:14 PM
P.S.

Bailout=Socialism
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Jan 8, 14 11:51 PM
1 member liked this comment
Blinders are the real self-created one . . .
By PBR (4956), Southampton on Jan 9, 14 9:06 AM
SAC Capital.

How many of your clients have money with this cheating, lying, and criminal firm bigfresh?

"Ten thousand dollars an hour worth of lawyers filed into a courtroom in lower Manhattan on the morning of Nov. 8. The legal team represented Steven Cohen’s hedge fund, SAC Capital Advisors, which had agreed to pay $1.2 billion to settle criminal charges that it had engaged in securities fraud. The hearing was the culmination of a long legal struggle between SAC and the ...more
Jan 9, 14 1:02 PM appended by Mr. Z
Or, how many of your clients made money with Galleon, or Sedna? Read this, if you've got the guts: Preet Bharara: Insider Trading Is “Rampant” On Wall Street
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Jan 9, 14 1:02 PM
Not sure if any of them do Z , does your retirement package have any money invested with any of these firms?

6 hours is not a day of work

If you're alluding to the minimum wage you should be aware that ENTRY LEVEL or LOW SKILLED jobs pay this wage. Anyone with a lick of sense or ambition will quickly rise above it. Hey, if you choose a career path that pays peanuts you have only yourself to blame!
By bigfresh (4666), north sea on Jan 9, 14 1:23 PM
Tough luck if WalMart or other big box retail came to your town, destroyed small business, and your well paying private sector job. Then, when they are the only game in town it's the people's fault.

Keep living in your test tube obtuse one...
Jan 9, 14 3:17 PM appended by Mr. Z
BTW, over 85% of the working public don't qualify to be invested with a hedge fund, most of which require at least half a million dollars to begin investing. Dope.
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Jan 9, 14 3:17 PM
And, it bears mentioning, that were it not for a grand act of socialism you would have nothing today and the estates you service would be empty husks waiting to become museums like in Newport, RI.

Were it not for socialism you and most of your wealthy clients would be on bread lines thanks to rampant, unfettered, unregulated capitalism. Have a good one...
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Jan 9, 14 3:29 PM
Jackson Browne -- "Running on Empty."

"Before the Deluge."

Etc.
By PBR (4956), Southampton on Jan 9, 14 4:11 PM
Whatever may come - Godsmack
Jan 16, 14 10:30 AM appended by Mr. Z
Come what(ever) may - Stone Sour
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Jan 16, 14 10:30 AM
Back to an On-Topic comment:

The article has been updated to a Print version, which supplies many added details. [See blue link at the top]
By PBR (4956), Southampton on Jan 9, 14 4:20 PM
1 member liked this comment


Chris Christie had a chance to get to the bottom of this months ago by picking up the phone to his high school buddy whom he appointed to the Port Authority and asking,"What the hell happened?"

Christie made no effort to get to the truth, and attacked the ones asking questions. He is a liar and a fraud. He's unfit to be governor, let alone President.

"The bridge story itself, while small in nature, reveals a political culture around Christie of people who have no business ...more
By They call me (2826), southampton on Jan 9, 14 6:10 PM
Are you self employed Z? If not , your retirement fund may hold some investments with the afore mentioned firms. Please prove your ASSertion that unfettered capitalism would lead to bread lines, more of a Marxist pipe dream than reality. Not sure why you once again ASSume that any of my clients were bailed out financially. You don't know who they are or how they have become quite financially successful. Once again class envy leaves you grasping at straws. Drive carefully .
By bigfresh (4666), north sea on Jan 10, 14 8:34 AM
2 members liked this comment
Happy 1000 B F
By joe hampton (3461), south hampton on Jan 10, 14 1:46 PM
You are just one of the fools who will NEVER live or see reality beyond your own little test tube. Somehow, I doubt my MMA/401k would EVER be involved with a hedge fund and even though it can't penetrate that thick skull of yours, the only reason the Great Depression was not repeated was the bailout, which would have left a full third of this country unemployed and the vast majority of your clientele in dire straits REGARDLESS of how they made their money.

Keep on keepin' on, while the ...more
Jan 11, 14 1:02 AM appended by Mr. Z
I just put my finger on who you remind me of. Zaphod Beeblebrox
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Jan 11, 14 1:02 AM
A third of the US population are out of work
January 10, 2014
The president gave a speech to call on congress to give those who are unemployed an extension of their benefits because they are unable to find work over a long period of time and for some time to come. Some of the unemployed were situated behind Obama, which is how things are done, as he spoke about their hardship and how it was the Republicans who were making their life miserable.

By joe hampton (3461), south hampton on Jan 11, 14 2:12 AM
1 member liked this comment
Its a great trick. Enact policies that not only do not create jobs but allow people to be out of work for an extended period of time and then use those people as a tool to blame the opposition for the situation they found themselves in. You would think this is part of a plan: talk down on capitalism and hurt it as much as possible and when things get bad for people say "I told you so" and fight to keep people dependent as a means of popularity.
By joe hampton (3461), south hampton on Jan 11, 14 2:12 AM
1 member liked this comment
So, the unemployment rate is at 33% in the world of joe where approximately 115 million people are out of work? Maybe you were thinking 33 million, or are suffering the same psychosis as bigfresh. The "official" number would be a bit over 23 million people out of work at 6.7%.

The policies which have us in this mess are the policies of the "Free Marketeers" and it took 30 years to blow up in this country's face. It will take far more than five to fix. There is no major war to pull ...more
Jan 11, 14 3:01 AM appended by Mr. Z
“Our ethos is all that we currently hold to be true. It is what we act upon. It governs our manners, our business and our politics.” ~ Howard Zinn
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Jan 11, 14 3:01 AM
1 member liked this comment
People Not In Labor Force Soar To Record 91.8 Million; Participation Rate Plunges To 1978 Levels
WSJ Jan. 8, 2014 8:57 p.m. ET

New NormalrecoveryUnemployment

.Curious why despite the huge miss in payrolls the unemployment rate tumbled from 7.0% to 6.7%? The reason is because in December the civilian labor force did what it usually does in the New Normal: it dropped from 155.3 million to 154.9 million, which means the labor participation rate just dropped to a fresh 35 year ...more
By 27dan (2854), Southampton on Jan 11, 14 3:36 AM
And there were 225 million people in this country in 1978.

Do we count the growing number of retirees (like "Baby Boomers") in that 91.8 million out of roughly 350,000,000?

BOLS:

Household Survey Data

The number of unemployed persons declined by 490,000 to 10.4 million in December, and the unemployment rate declined by 0.3 percentage point to 6.7 percent. Over the year, the number of unemployed persons and the unemployment rate were down by 1.9 million and 1.2 ...more
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Jan 11, 14 3:54 AM
1 member liked this comment
The "job creators" are wealthier than they EVER have been. Literally trillions in fiat currency sit idle in offshore accounts.

They have untold millions to spend on campaigns and lobbyists, so maybe we need to move to D.C. to get high paying K street jobs.
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Jan 12, 14 6:02 AM
Happy 1000 biggie.
By dnice (2346), Hampton Bays on Jan 10, 14 2:23 PM
And how much blame falls on your boy Barry? What has He done to improve the economy? The House and Senate were Demokrat for the first few years of His reign, He could have done what He wanted to help the economy instead of wasting His time with Obamacare.
By bigfresh (4666), north sea on Jan 11, 14 8:15 AM
bigfresh doesn't seem to grasp what the word "culture" means. At all.

You should try Neil Barofsky's "Bailout" if you have some time to read this Winter. You should see his interview with Jon Stewart from last February. Very enlightening information from the man who was SIG for the TARP program.
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Jan 11, 14 12:24 PM
You deflected again. What has your boy Barry done to help improve the economy? Don't blame the opposition, what has He done? Obamacare has resulted in a an increase in the cost of doing business, no help for the economy there.
By bigfresh (4666), north sea on Jan 11, 14 10:31 AM
1 member liked this comment
Once again, you have no concept of the culture in our capital.

You truly have no idea how psychologically dysfunctional the District of Columbia is, do you?
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Jan 11, 14 12:45 PM
Once again you occupy the occupy wall street mentality, This is America stop trying to change it to Sweden

Obama Care is hurting more Americans than it is helping. It is a bad law and will ruin America. It must be repealed & replaced with common sense.
1. Tort Reform,
2. competition across state lines,
3. Health savings accounts,
4. Portability,
5. Federal and State income tax exemptions for all health cost,
6. Tax incentives to the health industry,
...more
Jan 11, 14 1:33 PM appended by They call me
Pelosi to reporter its not called obamacare its the affordable care act. LOL Earth to Nancy, Obamacare is anything but affordable. How ridiculous this woman is, People are getting hurt under OBAMAcare and trying to get people to call it the ACA, doesn't change the fact that the OBAMA Owns this abomination. and the progressive movment will pay for their hubris and incompetence, and the ones who voted for OBAMAcare will lose their jobs but I'm sure that they will.still be in better shape than millions of middle class Americans.
By They call me (2826), southampton on Jan 11, 14 1:33 PM
1 member liked this comment
It was the hubris of the Republican Party which caused the economic meltdown.

You really don't want to go tit for tat with that little spot on the ol' record...
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Jan 12, 14 12:46 AM
To be fair Z, I think it was both parties that were responsible. We can go back to the community reinvestment act as one of the reasons for today's mess.
By dnice (2346), Hampton Bays on Jan 12, 14 5:51 PM
@dnice: CRA is a miniscule factor. Major factors are cultural, and systemic.

Though the CRA may have been a piece of gateway legislation and in introductory factor, the responsibility lies with the institutions who securitized and sold off loans they did not have to hold the note on. The ones who made money and had ZERO long term responsibility for their actions.

If the lenders were made to hold the note for 15, 20, or even 30 years you would not have seen the shenanigans which ...more
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Jan 13, 14 1:48 PM
Some data, for your consideration:

1. Private markets, rather than the GSEs, created the subprime mortgage boom.

The subprime mortgage boom and the subsequent crash are very much concentrated in the private market, not the public market. Subprime is a creature of the private label securitization channel (PLS) market, instead of the Government-Sponsored Entities (GSEs, or Fannie and Freddie). The fly-by-night lending boom, slicing and dicing mortgage bonds, derivatives and CDOs, ...more
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Jan 13, 14 1:59 PM
1 member liked this comment
Thanks for the info Z. Hard to argue with that.
By dnice (2346), Hampton Bays on Jan 13, 14 3:11 PM
Townhall.com
John Hawkins | Jan 11, 2014

Like Enron, Greece, and Donald Trump before us, America is about to go bankrupt. Unfortunately, our bankruptcy will probably be more Enron and less Donald Trump because we're very unlikely to come back bigger and better in the lifetime of anyone reading this column. Instead, most Americans are probably going to experience skyrocketing taxes, spiraling inflation, widespread disorder, and a dramatically reduced standard of living.

This ...more
By dnice (2346), Hampton Bays on Jan 11, 14 7:59 PM
Dam straight its falling and fast!

U.S. NATIONAL DEBT CLOCK

The Outstanding Public Debt as of 12 Jan 2014 at 07:33:40 AM GMT is:
$ 1 7 , 2 8 7 , 4 1 7 , 6 0 5 , 7 9 9 . 8 7

By They call me (2826), southampton on Jan 12, 14 2:34 AM
It is hilarious to me that anyone, from either party, can ignore the debt with a straight face.
By dnice (2346), Hampton Bays on Jan 12, 14 9:00 AM
2 members liked this comment
Despicable poster.
By dnice (2346), Hampton Bays on Jan 12, 14 12:57 PM
You need to go to Colorado and smoke a big fat one!






By Mets fan (1501), Southampton on Jan 13, 14 2:34 PM
1 member liked this comment
The fools that defaulted on their mortgages are to blame for the collapse of the housing bubble! No one held a gun to their head and made them take out a loan that they had no chance of paying back! There were some sketchy loans to be had, no income check anyone? But a contract is a contract.
By bigfresh (4666), north sea on Jan 13, 14 7:36 AM
2 members liked this comment
Yep. It's official.

You have no idea whatsoever what led to the housing bubble, or it's implosion. Only fools and the ignorant fall back to simple, idiotic, finger pointing, B******* talking points. You may want to consider how ratings agencies created a systemic bubble using ethereal things like derivatives, and companies like AIG selling uncapitalized insurance policies.

How about forming and intelligent, cogent, informed, and educated argument for a change?

Or, are ...more
Jan 13, 14 1:31 PM appended by Mr. Z
And, when "dirty hands" are involved; contracts are null and void.
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Jan 13, 14 1:31 PM
2 members liked this comment
Ah, Z eternal argument with . . . . . . ?
By PBR (4956), Southampton on Jan 13, 14 2:40 PM
Propaganda and lunacy at the corner of Bedlam and Squalor.
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Jan 15, 14 2:08 AM
And thus it shall ever be . . .
By PBR (4956), Southampton on Jan 15, 14 3:27 AM
It is time to get rid of the DOE, and the thousands of unelected bureaucrats they (we) employ
Then the EPA
Then the Treasury.
Then the Department of Education/Propaganda
Then the Department of Homeland Sekurity.
NSA, TSA, HUD, Dept of Commerce.
And most of the IRS. Put Fairtax in place and that department could be very small.
As long as we are dreaming, I think my first move would be to leave and defund the UN. It's not a coincidence the more we are involved with that ...more
By Undocumented Democrat (2065), southampton on Jan 13, 14 3:19 PM
The house of cards came tumbling down when the UNQUALIFIED borrowers signed on the dotted line. If they paid their mortgages instead of defaulting what would have happened? Nothing Komrade, no burst housing bubble.
By bigfresh (4666), north sea on Jan 13, 14 3:25 PM
Wrong. AGAIN. Most of those mortgages WERE stable as written.

The loans began their cascade of default when all the ARMs which Greenspan said everyone should have had their interest rates increased significantly. In 2001 the target Federal funds rate was 1.75%. It was lowered even further to 1%. This had an integral part to play in the housing boom.

Greenspan raised rates a grand total of SEVENTEEN times between 2004 and 2006, and when he left office in 2006 the funds rate ...more
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Jan 13, 14 5:16 PM
Z , Dont worry be happy...
By joe hampton (3461), south hampton on Jan 13, 14 10:29 PM
1 member liked this comment
I smile. And yes, I do laugh at times. Out loud. Hyterically even.

Yes, things are getting better. However we should not be in this position. But, you know what really should burn everybody? Just think about the fact that some very smart, educated, and experienced people were ignored or blackballed who called the whole mess years in advance. Brooksley Born is someone's story you should be familiar with, especially if you're not. We need our leaders to make better choices, and she's ...more
Jan 14, 14 12:08 AM appended by Mr. Z
And, I must say there is one word which will jump out at you if you read Economic History and it's disasters. That word would be "speculator". When the price of commodities is a result or reckless speculation rather than market fundamentals of supply and demand, there is a bit of a serious problem. To say such is true, and we have a problem would be rather accurate.
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Jan 14, 14 12:08 AM
The problem is the banks moved down the food chain for candidates of mortgages. Negative am mortgages were the last straw for the mortgage business. The financial wizards of the banking business tricked a lot of people into getting mortgages. Both Repubs and Dems are to blame for this nonsense of giving everyone the American dream. I remember the idiot Bernanke saying in 07 that the subprime meltdown was contained. Oh it was contained alright 12 trillion later in debt it is now contained.
By chief1 (2800), southampton on Jan 13, 14 6:21 PM
It's bigger than that. It's derivatives.

Courtesy of Lee Fang:

– October 6, 1986: First oil derivative is introduced to Wall Street by traders at Koch. Koch Industries executive Lawrence Kitchen devised the “first ever oil-indexed price swap between Koch Industries and Chase Manhattan Bank.” At the time, such derivatives had been limited to currency markets, and the shift of creating a synthetic financial instrument based on the value of crude oil was revolutionary. ...more
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Jan 14, 14 1:50 AM
THE ARMS STARTED DEFAULTING ATAN INCREDIBLE RATE. Thanks for making my point! Who in their right mind would take out an adjustable rate mortgage and ASSUME the rate will adjust down??!! Irresponsible behavior on the lendee's part.
By bigfresh (4666), north sea on Jan 14, 14 7:25 AM
Coming up short again.

Many of them were promised refinancing to a fixed rate by the lenders, which never materialized. Some people were also told their mortgages were fixed rates, only to find out later they were not. The phrase "predatory lending" exists for a reason. It increases the lender's profits who package and sell the mortgages off for a quick secondary profit in addition to the commission made on the loan itself. As a businessman, do you see securitization of mortgages encouraging ...more
Jan 14, 14 10:57 AM appended by Mr. Z
Mostly the practice was engaged in because "The Maestro" Alan Greenspan said it's a product everyone should have. He was taken at his word. I mean really, don't you know a thing about psychology or it's effects on the market?
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Jan 14, 14 10:57 AM
Still the fact remains, no one held a gun to the head of any prospective borrower and told them they MUST take out an ARM and not read the fine print. Sure there was predatory lending , but that doesn't excuse those who were scammed, if you don't understand what you're signing, don't!
By bigfresh (4666), north sea on Jan 14, 14 4:50 PM
Maestro said "ARMs are good, you should have one." What part of that don't you get? They did what this guy said. Then he ****** it up.

"I would not only reappoint Mr. Greenspan -- if Mr. Greenspan should happen to die, God forbid -- I would do like was did in the movie, 'Weekend at Bernie's.' I'd prop him up and put a pair of dark glasses on him and keep him as long as we could."

~ Then presidential candidate John McCain (1999)
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Jan 15, 14 2:07 AM
So, what you're saying is unethical business practices are OK, because people who are victimized by "dirty hands" and tricksters are to blame?

Someday I hope the Devil himself has you bound to a contract where you didn't understand the "fine print". Maybe then you'll be less of a "it didn't happen to me, so I don't give a ****" kind of idiot, extremist, conservative Republican.

I'm out. It's no fun arguing with stupid so thick it burns...
Jan 15, 14 12:47 PM appended by Mr. Z
"You work for Jimmy, you work hard." ~ Jimmy Wichard, "King of the Hill" (May 3, 1998)
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Jan 15, 14 12:47 PM
1 member liked this comment
Every time I refinanced my mortgage, I had an attorney present at closing to make sure everything was on the up and up, that old personal responsibility thing crops up again. It's like holy water to a vampire for the liberals out there. It's just like you to be against the banks Komrade. Without them, most folks wouldn't own their own homw.
By bigfresh (4666), north sea on Jan 15, 14 2:23 PM
Every time I refinanced my mortgage, I had an attorney present at closing to make sure everything was on the up and up, that old personal responsibility thing crops up again. It's like holy water to a vampire for the liberals out there. It's just like you to be against the banks Komrade. Without them, most folks wouldn't own their own home..
By bigfresh (4666), north sea on Jan 15, 14 2:23 PM
Glad to hear that Phil ...nice job
By joe hampton (3461), south hampton on Jan 15, 14 4:16 PM
The point is you shouldn't have to.

"Conservatives" like to say "deal with it". "Liberals" are like "that should NEVER happen."

Get the difference yet?
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Jan 16, 14 4:10 AM
1 member liked this comment
CRA loans were less than 7% of the mortgages. The same bubble was extant in the commercial market. Did the CRA prompt all those loans too?

Get over it, it had nothing to do with it.

"CRA and the Housing Bubble"

by Adam Levitin



There's an interesting new paper out on the role of the Community Reinvestment Act and the housing bubble. The paper, called "Did the Community Reinvestment Act (CRA) Lead to Risky Lending?" is by Sumit Agrawal, Efraim Benmelech, ...more
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Jan 16, 14 4:37 PM
Terrible news for haters of our free republic: Obamacare is collapsing
liberals spin Obamacare numbers — but they’ve already lost. The propaganda campaign is now wholly gratuitous.
By 27dan (2854), Southampton on Jan 15, 14 8:46 PM
In his State of the State address this afternoon, New Jersey Governor Chris Christie took responsibility for mistakes made during his watch, and he fired two of his closest aides.

By that standard, President Obama could spend his entire upcoming State of the Union speech -- more than an hour -- apologizing. He could apologize for the Obama care Web site, for that he lied to us about keeping our doctor and our health insurance, about Benghazi, about the economy, about the Internal Revenue ...more
By They call me (2826), southampton on Jan 15, 14 8:53 PM
There's a great meme going around. Goes something like this:

"The next time that someone tells you Obama is destroying the economy, remind them that the stock market and corporate profits are at an all-time high.

When they tell you this hasn't helped them any, remind them they just admitted trickle-down economics doesn't work."
Jan 16, 14 10:22 AM appended by Mr. Z
"Ever wonder why over 300,000 people in nine counties - in a rural state - were on the same water supply? It would be because an unregulated, unchecked coal company already poisoned the local watershed, forcing residents to shut down their wells, and lay pipe to the only surviving 'clean' water source."
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Jan 16, 14 10:22 AM
1 member liked this comment
Trickle down is a nice idea but as a concept has been around long enough for us to realize that it isn't happening.
By dnice (2346), Hampton Bays on Jan 16, 14 4:14 PM
.
.
.
.
drip
.
.
.
.
.
drip
.
.
.
.
.

[trickled down to here]
.
.
.
By PBR (4956), Southampton on Jan 16, 14 6:25 PM
1 member liked this comment
The economy is surging. ALL the economic indicators are up. Unemployment has fallen to 6.7%. Affordable Care enrolled 2.2 million new insureds by the end of December. Today, the House passed the federal budget by 359 to 67 despite Tea Party members' screeching (implicitly telling them to "F" off.)

Undeterred, the A Capella Cassandras of the Extreme Right Wing Chorus herein mournfully chant their delusional, despairing dirge, wistfully (and disloyally) praying for disaster so that The ...more
By highhatsize (4217), East Quogue on Jan 15, 14 11:10 PM
1 member liked this comment
Obama is a good campaigner but a terrible governor.
By dnice (2346), Hampton Bays on Jan 16, 14 8:35 PM
Purchased our home in 2000, 30 year mortgage @ 8.9%

Re finance in 2003 to a 15 year at 6.0% took no equity out
purchased land in 2008 using a second mortgage
re financed in 2010 to a 15 @ 4.0% rolled in the second mortgage for less than our original 30 year

saved over 50K Pretty responsible
By bigfresh (4666), north sea on Jan 16, 14 7:21 AM
Well this thread took the logical and predictable course of fatality by drunk driver to illegal immigration to minimum wage debate to Obama (love him / hate him) to the economy to Home mortgages.

By double standard (1506), Remsenburg on Jan 16, 14 7:56 AM
Come what(ever) may - Stone Sour
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Jan 16, 14 10:33 AM
Civil? Nah. The lines of division are already drawn and the characters line up accordingly. Then we all post variations of the same stuff that we always post. Then we feel coooooooolllll when someone likes our post. In the end no minds are changed and we did little more than vented or regurgitated propaganda.
Circle the bowl is what we do. Viva La Bowl.
By double standard (1506), Remsenburg on Jan 16, 14 11:36 AM
2 members liked this comment
We argue in the bowl and the feds keep printing away
By joe hampton (3461), south hampton on Jan 16, 14 12:50 PM
1 member liked this comment
It's a good idea but I doubt the discourse would be civil. There are some on this site that seem to believe civility is only needed in face to face interactions.
By pstevens (406), Wilmington on Jan 16, 14 1:11 PM
"We need a general forum where we can post and discuss topics; the nature of this comments section promotes confrontation.
I'd bet that there would be a lot more civil conversation.
There used to be one here but it was never utilized."

That is rich coming from you. Tried that with you and it didn't work because you don't really mean it. Lead by example, not by hollow words.
By dnice (2346), Hampton Bays on Jan 16, 14 4:12 PM
1 member liked this comment
This comment has been removed because it is a duplicate, off-topic or contains inappropriate content.
By dnice (2346), Hampton Bays on Jan 16, 14 8:28 PM
Yeah, Joe. The thing is that neither side really deserves the blind faith and defense of its followers. Both sides have failed all of us in a big way, and they count on us to sign up for a side and argue on their behalf. And so we do. So who are the idiots?
By double standard (1506), Remsenburg on Jan 16, 14 2:59 PM
1 member liked this comment
to Captn America:

Ah, the shrillest member of the chorus essays a solo.

So now, Captn, we should discount the unemployment rate, THE measure of workforce health for sixty years? Why should we do that? Is it, perhaps, because the ever-smaller rate (like surging auto sales, Affordable Care success, and Tea Party repudiation) manifests that the economy is improving and that the imminent arrival of the paradise of the mean-spirited that you have so long predicted is just a delusion?

Thanks ...more
By highhatsize (4217), East Quogue on Jan 16, 14 5:05 PM
You lost me at Affordable Care success.
By dnice (2346), Hampton Bays on Jan 16, 14 5:09 PM
In my personal opinion, even if 27east had (AGAIN!) an area for "civil" general comments, the herd here would go where they please and would disregard fences and borders. It goes where the action is!

I imagine the editors consider a certain amount of chaos "normal" for a public Internet forum, and they do allow some latitude for the cattle to meander from the path now and then.

One price paid for free speech and discourse, and paid gladly, given the alternatives?

Peace ...more
By PBR (4956), Southampton on Jan 16, 14 6:23 PM
How could you possibly have more rules than here... It is so typical of what you represent to wish for more regulation, I must admit I do find you fascinating ... I would love to know what formed your being
By joe hampton (3461), south hampton on Jan 16, 14 9:02 PM
What Joe said
By 27dan (2854), Southampton on Jan 16, 14 9:23 PM
Yeah, 'cause who needs proper regulation and inspections.

Maybe people in West Virginia?

Someday maybe you anti-government zealots will realize the pawns of greedy men who believe in nothing but their own avarice.

But probably not...
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Jan 18, 14 2:54 PM
Phil, yours is a hard left stance. That's fine and you don't hide it. You lose us when you label anyone with a differing opinion a "right wing radical." Besides it not being at all true, it weakens your arguments. There's an awful lot of middle ground out there despite what our wonderful leaders and the dopes on TV want us to believe. You should explore it sometime. America is a large and diverse place. We march to many drums.
By double standard (1506), Remsenburg on Jan 16, 14 10:07 PM
to Captn America:

Dear me, I thought that I already had stated the facts: A 6.7% unemployment rate according to the unemployment measure which, despite your dislike of it, has been THE STANDARD INDEX for comparing workforce health for sixty years - AND - 2.2 million new insureds under Affordable Care by the end of December - AND - auto sales hit a SIX YEAR HIGH in November.

Things are getting better, Captn, and have done so, steadily, since you and your colleagues first began ...more
By highhatsize (4217), East Quogue on Jan 16, 14 10:32 PM
Dear me , The name is Howell Thurston Howell the third, Now pass that mustard

And for the last time its OBAMA CARE! He owns it

BABY!
Jan 17, 14 12:43 AM appended by They call me
GALLUP: OBAMA SLIPS BACK TO 30S...
By They call me (2826), southampton on Jan 17, 14 12:43 AM
HHS, while not a fan of the tea party I don't think it is time to throw dirt on them nor is it time to celebrate any of the temporary surges as a result of QE. The true ramifications of QE, and for that matter the ACA, have not been measured yet.
By dnice (2346), Hampton Bays on Jan 16, 14 10:50 PM
Santelli to Obama: How Can We Redistribute Wealth If There Is No Wealth?

Easy we just make more
Jan 17, 14 12:48 AM appended by They call me
U.S. NATIONAL DEBT CLOCK The Outstanding Public Debt as of 17 Jan 2014 at 05:50:15 AM GMT is: $ 1 7 , 2 9 0 , 3 0 4 , 9 2 7 , 7 1 2 . 2 9
By They call me (2826), southampton on Jan 17, 14 12:48 AM
to dnice:

I agree. The enormous federal debt has made us so fragile that any medium-sized catastrophe, worldwide, has the potential to throw us back into recession, opening the door for the reemergence of the Tea Party zombies. Their lust for such an event, as revealed by their comments herein, is as disturbing as it is revelatory of their character.
By highhatsize (4217), East Quogue on Jan 17, 14 9:31 AM
Capitalize profits.
Socialize losses.

Seems like the way things are run in the last thirty years or so...
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Jan 18, 14 7:13 PM
1 member liked this comment
to Captn America:

Tea Party legislators avidly seek a reduction of federal spending - except in their home districts. As I pointed out on another forum to a resident of a Tea Party congressional district that has received hundreds of millions of dollars in federal highway construction funds (and is slated to receive hundreds of millions more), when HIS representative pledges to reject those upcoming funds, we can talk about other cuts. (Of course, HIS funding is “essential” ...more
By highhatsize (4217), East Quogue on Jan 17, 14 3:04 PM
To HHS... You are fond of calling your ideological opposition cruel

You say... Tea Partiers preach jeremiads about the national debt, that pretense of concern is but a mask for their only real interests, to wit, keeping as much of their own money as possible and preventing anyone else from getting anything for free.

Are we supposed to feel guilty for wanting to keep what we have earned
for our family's and charity's of our choice ?

Let me ask you something.

Would ...more
By joe hampton (3461), south hampton on Jan 17, 14 7:36 PM
Joe, He is just like Phil and decided to pretend he has not seen your last post, since he just left a post at 12:16 about deer, and seems to have scoffed at your comment
By Undocumented Democrat (2065), southampton on Jan 19, 14 12:35 PM
NSA Official: 'We Are Now a Police State

Last year, high-ranking NSA official Bill Binney said, “We are, like, that far from a turnkey totalitarian state.” Now, Binney says that the U.S. has already become a full-blown police state.

Binney told Washington Times on Wednesday

'We are the frogs and the water is beginning to boil. Obama didn't start this totalitarian trend, but has been one of the most active at expanding it.
By Undocumented Democrat (2065), southampton on Jan 17, 14 7:07 PM
If you like your privacy, you can keep it...

But in the meantime, we're going to keep collecting your phone records, your e-mails, your text messages, and likely your credit card information.

By joe hampton (3461), south hampton on Jan 19, 14 1:29 PM
This comment has been removed because it is a duplicate, off-topic or contains inappropriate content.
By They call me (2826), southampton on Jan 18, 14 2:35 PM
Mr Shaw,
Why am I reading comments on the economy from a story dealing with a fatal MVA in Hampton Bays?
By But I'm a blank! (1283), Hampton Bays on Jan 18, 14 6:18 PM
1 member liked this comment
Obama: “I would not let my son play pro football.”

But he would let his son be like Trayvon and smoke dope ???
By They call me (2826), southampton on Jan 19, 14 12:24 PM
Its ok UD I was reading an article last night the "Hinge Point of a political bubble" that describes Hat heads frustration as of late...

It talked about a clear sign of a market bubble is when investors discount all evidence that doesn’t fit their belief.

and called that a “hinge point” that leads investors to a “binary framework where anybody who disagrees with them is demonized.”

That perfectly describes the cult of Barack Obama and the ...more
By joe hampton (3461), south hampton on Jan 19, 14 1:17 PM
What Joe said
By 27dan (2854), Southampton on Jan 19, 14 5:41 PM
to joe hampton:

Your post is wholly irrelevant, misdirected and loggorheic.

Because the extreme Right-Wing prostrates itself slavishly before every shallow demagogue who spouts rhetoric justifying its meanness (the latest being Ted Cruz), you assume that normal people share that behavior.

We do not. In the case of President Obama, we see a fallible man but one whose policies, rationally examined, will assure the future well-being of all Americans. The curious Right-Wing ...more
By highhatsize (4217), East Quogue on Jan 19, 14 2:27 PM
2 members liked this comment
Townhall.com
John Hawkins | Jan 18, 2014

Saying that life is hard is kind of like saying the sun is hot, water is wet, or noting that politicians lie a lot. It's so obvious that anyone who's paying attention already knows that it's true. That being said, life's even harder when you're working under false assumptions that have been drilled into you by your teachers, college professors, Hollywood, and politicians in D.C. Much of what liberalism drums into the young skulls full of mush ...more
By dnice (2346), Hampton Bays on Jan 19, 14 10:09 PM
You want "substance"? Here ya' go.


"This week, the world’s wealthy and powerful meet in Davos, Switzerland, for their annual talk fest and exchange of business cards. This year several panels have been organized around the theme of widening inequality – which has grown even more extreme since the Great Recession, both in the U.S. and around the world. As you probably know, the 400 richest Americans have more wealth than the bottom half of the American population combined ...more
Jan 20, 14 1:11 PM appended by Mr. Z
dnice, there's one group you forgot about. There's a host of people who did the right thing, invested to hedge against inflation, saved, and even had retirement accounts. The malfeasance of others DID cost many everything they worked "x" amount of years for. Do you nitwits really think that over 100 million Americans are lazy? Or that a closed sect of our society is just damnably greedy?
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Jan 20, 14 1:11 PM
Z, you calling me nitwit?
By dnice (2346), Hampton Bays on Jan 21, 14 5:27 PM
Oh my how you nuts get off topic... I read most of the posts. If I had to read all I'd be here till next Sunday! Getting back to alchol, drugs etc I hate to admit it but I would be in favor of leaglizing the dredded pot. Reason: My father, who occasionally ran with the rumrunners of the 1920's, told me that we would all be better off if there never had been the "Prohibition" law. That situation in the roaring 20's caused more alcoholics in the Hamptons than you would believe. Drunk driving is ...more
By summertime (589), summerfield fl on Jan 19, 14 5:10 PM
The world would be a better place if cannabis prohibition did not exist.

As an industrial product it is not only a direct competitor to petroleum, it could almost eliminate it as an industry. Why else would the interests of the Hearst, DuPont, Anslinger, et al. corrupt our Congress with their petrochemical profits, and illegalize it wholesale?

Legal hemp = No "Big Oil"
Jan 20, 14 1:55 PM appended by Mr. Z
And, you can also tack on that the possibility exists that if hemp remained legal, much of our old growth forest would remain, and Hearst would have had significant competition from it as he had a major interest in the timber industry. It begs the question of who was right. A bunch of greedy men and corrupt politicians, or Mother Nature...
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Jan 20, 14 1:55 PM
2 members liked this comment
KEYSTONE PIPELINE
By 27dan (2854), Southampton on Jan 20, 14 12:50 PM
I will see you KEYSTONE PIPE LINE and raise you a BENGAZI an NSA and a IRS scandel
By They call me (2826), southampton on Jan 20, 14 1:10 PM
And I'll raise you a ton of things you're most likely clueless about.

OIL: An analysis by the Associated Press finds that 750 “oil field incidents,” including 300 pipeline spills, have occurred in North Dakota in less than two years without public notification.

ALSO: New technology will help reduce natural gas flaring in the Bakken, and the Canadian government won’t require in-situ oil sands processing to undergo federal environmental review. (Bismarck Tribune, ...more
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Jan 20, 14 1:17 PM
I'm in, and I will raise both of you an "OBAMAcare" a Arab Spring and an out of sequence birth certificate with a Connecticut SS # and a Grandma with a bad memory.
By Undocumented Democrat (2065), southampton on Jan 20, 14 1:43 PM
Opps... 3 queens Z wins take your $ 1 7 , 2 9 0 , 3 0 4 , 9 2 7 , 7 1 2 . 2 9

TCM deals... Anti up !
By joe hampton (3461), south hampton on Jan 20, 14 1:47 PM
Government is the problem, not the solution Komrades! I'll trump all of you with a Marxist community organizer who never worked a day in His life being installed as president of the USA
By bigfresh (4666), north sea on Jan 21, 14 8:07 AM
2 members liked this comment
Remember the Solyndra card is wild
By They call me (2826), southampton on Jan 21, 14 10:48 AM
Ronald Reagan.

Great corporate spokesman, crappy president. Since people are the government, wouldn't that make them the problem as well? And, since corporations are people, and have the most influence in government, that would tend to make them a problem too.

"We balanced the budget", said no Republican POTUS since Eisenhower.

You just can't fix stupid.
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Jan 21, 14 1:57 PM
Mr. Reagan, People like Z and your wifes boy fancy pants talk nonsense.

Thank you Sir for all did for this once great country. Your son Michael misses you and so do we.
By joe hampton (3461), south hampton on Jan 21, 14 5:04 PM
What Bigfresh said
Jan 21, 14 5:53 PM appended by 27dan
And most defiantly what Joe said
By 27dan (2854), Southampton on Jan 21, 14 5:53 PM
This comment has been removed because it is a duplicate, off-topic or contains inappropriate content.
By dnice (2346), Hampton Bays on Jan 21, 14 6:09 PM
Looks like we were badly lacking government in the Dakotas, West Virginia, Nebraska, and Texas (West Fertilizer) as of late.

Reagan handed this country over to the financial industry (think Donald Regan, and Mellonomics, or "horse and sparrow"). The people of Germany tore down the Berlin Wall. The Soviet Union fell to it's own hubris. S&Ls, Iran-Contra, bombed Libya, invaded Grenada, and began the failed "War on Drugs". Teflon POTUS, they say.

Cowboy, spokesman, B grade actor, ...more
Jan 22, 14 3:42 AM appended by Mr. Z
"This is the West, sir. When the legend becomes fact, print the legend". ~ Carleton Young as Maxwell Scott in "The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance"
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Jan 22, 14 3:42 AM
And, how could we forget Beirut.

241 dead.

Happy Anniversary.
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Jan 22, 14 4:02 AM
can't delete the truth no matter how hard you try and spin it
By Erin 27 E (1281), southampton on Jan 22, 14 1:33 PM
Phil, maybe it will but I'm sure you'll have a screenshot of it saved. You know, for a cut and paste moment later.
By dnice (2346), Hampton Bays on Jan 22, 14 1:36 PM
It would be disingenuous to delete a opinion with such a overwhelming consensus

Surly Mr. Shaw can see from the conga line of support you received for you "opinion" Danice that there is no malice here only a popular conjecture.

After all wasn't it Phil who said last week that what we post hear is only opinion.

Live and let live... Surfs up TTYL
By joe hampton (3461), south hampton on Jan 22, 14 3:18 PM
There was a "consensus" when Germany invaded Poland too.
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Jan 22, 14 3:33 PM
Due to Goebbels censoring free speech and replacing it with government propaganda,

Why do you fear popular opinion ?

Do you feel your opinions are somehow more relevant than the cobbling down conclusions of the collective, not very communist of you Z
Jan 22, 14 3:41 PM appended by They call me
do
By They call me (2826), southampton on Jan 22, 14 3:41 PM
So, Germans weren't angry that German territory was lost to Poland (West Prussia, Poznan, and Upper Silesia) in accordance with the Treaty of Versailles?

You must be in some state of bliss. Try picking up a history book that isn't bull****. It would sorely help.
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Jan 22, 14 4:23 PM
Oh yeah, consensus is a bad thing, leads to mob rule and all. Better let the smart people make all the tough decisions round here!!
By dnice (2346), Hampton Bays on Jan 22, 14 5:57 PM
8 to you sounds like popular opinion to me.

The post will stand
By Undocumented Democrat (2065), southampton on Jan 22, 14 6:03 PM
1 member liked this comment
Suffering yet again from a lack of originality.
By dnice (2346), Hampton Bays on Jan 22, 14 7:41 PM
"It's only popular among those who hold that opinion.
But so was burning witches, killing Indians, enslaving blacks, trading guns for hostages, keeping minorities from voting, paying women less for the same work, lying about 'yellowcake' to take us to war, cutting food stamps, cutting unemployment, attacking voting rights (again), denying access to health care by voting to repeal healthcare reform 50 times, shutting down the government for no reason, and failing to deliver jobs as promised.
Anything ...more
By dnice (2346), Hampton Bays on Jan 22, 14 7:46 PM
1 member liked this comment
The post will stand KMA and have I magical day
By Undocumented Democrat (2065), southampton on Jan 23, 14 2:48 AM
Danzig!
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Jan 23, 14 3:00 PM
Look to Texas and how their job opportunities and economy are booming. They are business friendly, unlike NY.
By dnice (2346), Hampton Bays on Jan 21, 14 6:20 PM
Wall Street adviser: Actual unemployment is 37.2%, 'misery index' worst in 40 years

Don't believe the happy talk coming out of the White House, Federal Reserve and Treasury Department when it comes to the real unemployment rate and the true “Misery Index.” Because, according to an influential Wall Street advisor, the figures are a fraud.

In a memo to clients provided to Secrets, David John Marotta calculates the actual unemployment rate of those not working at a sky-high ...more
By 27dan (2854), Southampton on Jan 21, 14 9:29 PM
to 27dan:

This nonentity whom you cite, David John Marotta, is deemed "an influential Wall Street advisor" only by the WND, a minor Right-Wing propaganda website that still insists that President Obama wasn't born in Hawaii. In reality he's a nobody who writes silly, extremist opinions that nobody takes seriously, except YOU, 27dan.

All a blogger need do is to post some outrageous prediction of disaster and it becomes viral within the extreme Right-Wing.
By highhatsize (4217), East Quogue on Jan 21, 14 11:03 PM
Uhhh no, I read it first in the weekly standard which makes sense since the owner of TWS is Clarity Media Group who also owns The Washington examiner where the story originated By Paul Bedard | JANUARY 21, 2014 AT 1:08 PM

The Washington Headquarters 1015 15th St. NW
Suite 500
Washington, D.C. 20005
United States
Circulation 45,000 (weekly magazine)

The Washington Examiner is a political journalism publication based in Washington, D.C., that distributes its content ...more
By 27dan (2854), Southampton on Jan 22, 14 12:43 AM
to 27dan:

You have missed the point (again.) David John Marotta is a nonentity with no reputation whatsoever. His sensational opinion appeared in a private memo to clients that was picked up and published by conservative news sites ONLY, and only because of its sensationalism. To make his "analysis" seem more serious, he was christened "an influential Wall Street advisor" (without any substantiation) by Paul Bedard of The Washington Examiner (a Right-Wing organ.) No mainstream media ...more
By highhatsize (4217), East Quogue on Jan 22, 14 3:00 AM
Nationally speaking , The king of NY already publicly stated we are not welcome here so we will put our time and money into other races across the country in an effort to try and save the republic as a whole from progressive destruction
Jan 22, 14 5:44 AM appended by 27dan
King Andrew M. Cuomo More of that famed liberal Tolerance at work! No amount of wiggling by Cuomo's 'counselor' can change what the Governor said...and certainly meant.Besides they are already leaving...and taking their money with them. Soon, you'll have your liberal Utopia. You will not be able to fund it, but at least you'll have it
By 27dan (2854), Southampton on Jan 22, 14 5:44 AM
To HHS...

You speak as if you are a public entity

You say No mainstream media ...more carried it because it's just silly.
you no what else they have chosen not to carry the latest developments on Benghazi a serious story that deserves proper investigation at the very least.

But we have seen wall to wall coverage of a traffic jam in Longwood NJ (Do the math)

The MSM as continually covered this train wreck reporting on important stories only when it fits ...more
By joe hampton (3461), south hampton on Jan 22, 14 3:05 PM
1 member liked this comment
Beirut.
Jan 22, 14 3:53 PM appended by Mr. Z
“An imbalance between rich and poor is the oldest and most fatal ailment of all republics.” -Plutarch
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Jan 22, 14 3:53 PM
May the rich get richer! A rising tide lifts all ships.
By bigfresh (4666), north sea on Jan 22, 14 5:28 PM
Unless of course the banking industry hits an iceberg.

1980-2008
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Jan 23, 14 12:42 PM
Better start paddling instead of sinking in the whirlpool of class envy!
By bigfresh (4666), north sea on Jan 23, 14 7:22 AM
Zeitgeist: Addendum


Keep playing that worthless card. The people in control love you for it.
Jan 23, 14 12:41 PM appended by Mr. Z
Confessions of an Economic Hitman, by John Perkins
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Jan 23, 14 12:41 PM
CLASS WARFARE.

Democrats aren’t perfect but it’s the Republicans who are mounting a war against the poor and working class – opposing extended benefits for the long-term unemployed, fighting an increase in the minimum wage, rejecting any expansion of Medicaid, opposing investments in education and job-training, rejecting any jobs program, busting unions, and seeking repeal of the Affordable Care Act. But all the GOP has to do to win a Senate majority next fall is pick ...more
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Jan 23, 14 1:00 PM
1 member liked this comment
thanks for the idea Mr Z, just sent the max donation allowed by law to AMERICANS FOR PROSPERITY!
By bigfresh (4666), north sea on Jan 23, 14 3:05 PM
1 member liked this comment
Either you're a liar, or are incapable of realizing you're being used.



5 Right-Wing Myths About Raising the Minimum Wage, Debunked

The corporate/conservative machine is grinding out propaganda against raising the minimum wage.

January 23, 2014


If the 1968 federal minimum wage had kept pace with inflation it would be $10.75 today. But it is only $7.25, an amount so low that many full-time workers need government assistance such as food stamps, ...more
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Jan 25, 14 11:22 AM
to bigfresh:

There is NO LEGAL LIMIT to the amount that one may contribute to a PAC (not associated with a particular candidate.) How odd that Americans for Prosperity neglected to inform you of this when you made what you thought was the "max donation allowed by law".

By highhatsize (4217), East Quogue on Jan 23, 14 7:24 PM
1 member liked this comment
This comment has been removed because it is a duplicate, off-topic or contains inappropriate content.
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Jan 25, 14 5:49 AM
WOW

UPDATE: ANTI-OBAMA MOVIEMAKER INDICTED...

Cuomo subpoenas conservative activist James O'Keefe...

IRS targets conservative group in Hollywood...

Jill Abramson: 'Most secretive White House I have ever dealt with'...

NOONAN: DOJ out of control, No one's listening to Obama now...
Jan 23, 14 11:34 PM appended by 27dan
Really seems like the wheels are coming off the apple cart today
By 27dan (2854), Southampton on Jan 23, 14 11:34 PM