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Mar 9, 2010 4:22 PMPublication: The East Hampton Press

Myriad views on deer control in East Hampton Town

Mar 9, 2010 4:22 PM

Deer and people are living in ever closer proximity in East Hampton, and the tales of how their lives are entwined range from that of a bicyclist who died when a car hit a deer, which then hit him, to the story of a doe lactating and feeding her fawns in a woman’s driveway, to the ever-more-common stories of wild deer running through the woods with arrows still in them after a bow hunter’s shot failed to kill them.

And each person’s opinion of what to do about the deer population seemed intensely different from the next when the East Hampton Town Board opened up Town Hall for a “deer summit” on Thursday. The crush of opinionated people created another issue for board members, who scrambled to find extra chairs for the 150 plus residents who crammed into the hallways, craning their necks to see and hear speakers talk about the best way to manage the deer herd.

The room seemed nearly equally divided between hunting advocates and people for whom the killing of deer seemed a senseless slaughter. Applause for both positions was frequent, though the tone of the interaction was respectful on the whole.

But one speaker, Mary Jean Green of Hampton Bays, raised the hackles of hunters in the room.

“Every serial killer started as a hunter,” she said, turning her head and nodding to a group of hunting advocates on the left side of the meeting room, who responded with shocked gasps. “They all started by killing animals.”

Eve Houlihan, also of Hampton Bays, said that the town’s hunting program was “way too liberal.”

Hunters, who are allowed a 20-day shotgun season and a three-month-long bow hunting season, said that the exact opposite was true.

“The hunting areas are so loaded with hunters that the deer leave immediately,” said Hugh Miles of Springs, who added that 23 pieces of land have been closed to hunting by East Hampton Town since 2005. “Hunters do a job for nothing. I do hope we can get something done for hunters.”

Mr. Miles added that a test program in which the East Hampton Group for Wildlife placed reflectors along a section of Stephen Hands Path to scare deer away from the road is apparently successful only because the farmer who lives near that section of the road planted potatoes this year.

“Deer don’t eat potatoes,” he said. “They eat corn.”

Zachary Cohen, chairman of the town’s Nature Preserve Committee, said that the committee, which oversees hunting grounds, needs to restrict hunting in areas where new houses are built, because the state does not allow hunting within 500 feet of a house.

Terry O’Riordan, a hunter, said that he everyone he talks to tells him they think the deer population is out of control.

“Deer feces contaminate our sports fields. The woods are almost entirely barren up to five feet,” he said. “The average deer eats about 40 salads a day. The supply of vegetation is not self-sustainable.”

Mr. O’Riordan added that hunters had given more than 2,000 pounds of venison to the East Hampton food bank during hunting season this year.

Michael Clark, an environmental biologist with the New York State Department of Environmental Conservation, told the crowd that hunters in East Hampton last year took a record 475 deer. He added that the DEC is encouraging the hunting of does, who give birth to two to three fawns per year, by allowing an unlimited number of antlerless tags.

“Deer are polygamous, so the key to population management is the antlerless harvest,” he said, to the sound of whimpers from anti-hunting members of the audience. “Every female you take out takes out three deer. If you don’t take the antlerless out, the population can increase 50 percent in one year. They can deplete natural resources and eat themselves out of house and home.”

Mr. Clark said that the DEC relies on hunters to control the deer population, but that not many young people still hunt. He asked the town to help promote hunting among young people and to help lobby to decrease the distance from houses, which is currently 500 feet, that hunters can hunt.

Bill Crain, a child psychologist and member of the East Hampton Group for Wildlife, said that Mr. Clark was intentionally using words like “taking” and “culling” to desensitize the public to what hunters do.

“We should be forthright and say we are killing deer,” he said. “Very few people are speaking for animals. We should ask ourselves, ‘What’s it like to be hunted?’ There’s probably no species that has greater maternal regard for her young than the doe. What’s it like for a fawn to see her mother killed by a gun or an arrow?”

Dan Gilrain, of Cornell Cooperative Extension, said that a pilot program on Shelter Island known as the “four-poster,” which uses a series of baiting stations that spread the insecticide Permethrin on deer, was helping to reduce the number of ticks that live on deer, which carry diseases ranging from Lyme Disease to ehrlichiosis to tick-borne encephalitis. He said that Shelter Island has also been facing an infestation of Lone Star ticks, which many people are bit by and think are chiggers.

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Homo sapiens is a mean predator. We can't change our fundamental nature. But education allows us a clear view of our motives. Hunters enjoy killing animals. That's the bottom line. Should we encourage killers to live among us?
By highhatsize (4217), East Quogue on Mar 10, 10 2:47 PM
Wildlife serial killing hunters do shoot mothers even while protecting their babies. Watch this videos. Mind you, I watch hunting snuff videos to learn, I visit hunting forums to learn, most of my stuff is not from an ARA websites but from yours whether it be the hunting snuff videos that hunters love to show off their killing to somehow feel "important" to other killers or reading their forums. Nothing but bragging and laughters in the expense of animal suffering.


Put ...more
By Caroline Thompson (30), Sag harbor on Mar 16, 10 8:52 AM
well, i had a deer try to kill me. so i dont feel bad returning the favor when i can!

in one sense i do agree. those attempted murdering deer shouldn't live among us, and theyre delicious!
By ratboy (17), sousd-hampton on Mar 11, 10 12:00 AM
If they are so :"delicious" why do you marinate them for hours and then season them like crazy.? MOst of you don't even eat the meat beause of risk of CWD/Prions and you cannot boil or burn the disease away. They are defective proteins so abd why wheh they kill , epecially the big buck der with the rack (who wants tough meat). Older buck have tough meat so they "give" to the pantries. Easytto "give" what ou don't want isnt it? Plus DNR can sell more tags because the "sportsman" know where to ...more
By Caroline Thompson (30), Sag harbor on Mar 15, 10 8:28 PM
Wolves and deer were gone from this area for over a century. Deer were re=introduced in the late 19th Century. Wolves were not. There is no natural predator now except man. We have the responsibility to keep the population of deer in check and healthy. Predation, hunting, is the best way to do this.

Deer are not Banbi, they don't "miss" a missing herd member. They are interested in eating, dominating and reproducing. Despite their size, they are markedly less intelegent than a house ...more
By Lost Tribe (66), East Hampton on Mar 11, 10 1:00 AM
Humanity is just as guilty of overpopulating the East End, as the deer are.

This is moreover a people problem, as we seem to have left no postage stamp undeveloped.

Most deer graze on grasses to supplant their diet. All those beautiful, living room carpet grade lawns wouldn't be contributing to a spike in the population, would it?

In addition, if certain parties didn't spend a s***load of money on landscaping that shouldn't really be there anyway, there wouldn't be a ...more
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Mar 11, 10 1:51 PM
I had East End Fence & Gate put in a Deer fence and it has worked 100% Before that I tried everything. Human hair, Some sort of urine from a web site, I hung soap. Sprayed like a fool.... Its all Bunk. Since the fence I can plant again. Thank you Doug It worked just like you said It would and those 6 foot high rats are finally out of my life. And I hope for good!
By joe hampton (3461), south hampton on Mar 11, 10 9:37 PM
Talk about "rats" ? Humans are the only creatures on this earth that kills for sports, trophy, amusment , greed, and power. Deer are beautiful creatures that are living in a world that inhabited by so many humans. Human overpopulation is the problme and I say adopt and stop having babies after babies. Planet earth is choking with humans.
By Caroline Thompson (30), Sag harbor on Mar 15, 10 8:42 PM
1 member liked this comment
I had East End Fence & Gate put in a Deer fence and it has worked 100% Before that I tried everything. Human hair, Some sort of urine from a web site, I hung soap. Sprayed like a fool.... Its all Bunk. Since the fence I can plant again. Thank you Doug It worked just like you said It would and those 6 foot high rats are finaly out of my life. And I hope for good!
By joe hampton (3461), south hampton on Mar 11, 10 9:37 PM
Joe, do you work for East end Fence and Gate?

Isn't deer fencing illegal unless you have a permit?
By Tree Man (19), Southampton on Mar 12, 10 11:34 AM
No, lol ...sorry for the double post it was an accident, They were just very professional and delivered what they promised. I was going crazy before I had the fence.I am just happy to be rid of those tick carrying vultures. They killed off 35,000 worth of landscaping in one winter It ridiculous. I want them gone and my jerk of a neighbor feeds them.
By joe hampton (3461), south hampton on Mar 12, 10 1:03 PM
Then pray tell why PA. where hnting is huge their the lyme disease incindent is just as huge as been lke that for many number of years.
By Caroline Thompson (30), Sag harbor on Mar 15, 10 8:30 PM
I know this is pie in the sky but here goes. It's bad to feed deer but some people feel sorry for them. Maybe those particular deer can be neutered (it is possible but more expensive). The biggest thing to do is conserve habitat. I see woods taken down to build storage units (what a waste!) and other unnecessary buildings (houses that can't be sold in this market). Cutting restrictions are often ignored by homeowners living in wooded areas and the deer have no place to go but the roads where ...more
By darwin (47), southampton on Mar 12, 10 4:00 PM
“Hunters do a job for nothing. I do hope we can get something done for hunters.”

Of course you do the job for "nothing" because your digusting kind enjoy snuffing out a life of an innocent animals who have done you no harm.

If hunting was about "reduction" of deer herd why is it that when I read 'deer managment" website all I read is thing pertaining to "adding" deer. Here some example.

"The number of new deer added to the pre-hunt population is a function of the ...more
By Caroline Thompson (30), Sag harbor on Mar 12, 10 8:06 PM
That is why they reject deer birth control even though its been known to work well at Dr. Jay Kirkptrick has quoted on his video. Here is two version one I shortened for the slow learners (sports hunters)

And a little longer version'
60% in deer herd reduction

Deer are hungry mr. man in blue with no name. They will eat what they can find and that is why its important to buy ...more
By Caroline Thompson (30), Sag harbor on Mar 12, 10 8:46 PM
For those who support this barbaric and cruel killing will also have blood on their hands. I bet some of them sit down with their cute little fi fi dog and give him love, care and attention while at the same time cheer for killing of deer who is no different then the dog. Both sentient being capable of feeling fear, terror, pain and suffering. Here is what a Veterinarian has said about deer hit with arrow (which most time is the lungs) but its been hit on all parts of the body because these wildlife ...more
By Caroline Thompson (30), Sag harbor on Mar 13, 10 12:49 PM
I happen to like my flowers & veggies, if a deer is going to trespass to feed (destroy) on them, I hope it does get shot! These animals are out of control & need to be remedied, one way or the other.

Granted all mammals feel pain, pleases spare us the comparison of deer to humans. As for Jesus, he lived in the desert where there were no deer. Had he been subjected to their indiscriminate grazing & condoned it then your reference may have some validity. He died for our sins right? This ...more
By ICE (1214), Southhampton on Mar 15, 10 6:32 PM
Should have been "shame" in last sentence.
By ICE (1214), Southhampton on Mar 15, 10 6:36 PM
For the man in blue again, seem that wildlife killers love to ue the excuse of "Jesus died for our sins" so that means man can do what ever they wish because Jesus will save their a**. Is that right? So rape, slavery is "ok"? Because in the bible that is what was condone by "God" as well did you know that. ?

Seem killers love to cling onto "Jesus died for our sin" excuse. Jesus expect you to do your part is showing compassion and helping those who are "lesser then".

St. Francis ...more
By Caroline Thompson (30), Sag harbor on Mar 15, 10 7:38 PM
I have a nice flower and veggie garden and I use afence at least 6-7 feet ttall and I have no problem with deer. But this year I will put up a St . Francis statue and put flowers there just for them to eat, they do get hungry you know just like you do. So selfish its always me , me , me, my garden. There are tons of ways to keep deer away from your precious tulips.
By Caroline Thompson (30), Sag harbor on Mar 15, 10 7:57 PM
Why are the hunters "giving" to the pantries?? I always hear hunter say how "yummy" venison is and how they kill to "stuff their freezer" so there you have tons of dead bodies to "stuff the freezer" so do it. I told you they kill because they enjoy it not for the meat.

Plus with the risk or all the deer diseases you think hunters would want to eat those deer. I don't think so.
By Caroline Thompson (30), Sag harbor on Mar 13, 10 1:10 PM
Okay, I have the natural ecologically balanced solution, re-introduce the Wolf.
By ICE (1214), Southhampton on Mar 15, 10 6:46 PM
I live in the village of East Hampton and now the SOBs want me to cut my fence down to 6 ft and put a wire on top. What an eye sore My fence was very invisible. Why cant you people just leave us alone. I can only assume this this madness as been adopted so the deer can ravage my back yard. Are you happy now Mr Z ? Its disgusting how no one can mind there own business. Well vote and I am going to make sure I hold the people who in-acted this law responsible.
By 27dan (2854), south hampton on Mar 14, 10 12:02 AM
This is my blogger and I get all information from the hunting website of "deer managemen" and how they are producing dee for recreational klling .for exampe. And also info about CRE.


"Thus, late fall up to early winter is very important for deer herd managers to impact and influence fawn production, so make sure the plant communities on your property is properly managed deer habitat. " ...more
By Caroline Thompson (30), Sag harbor on Mar 15, 10 8:16 PM
They always talk about 'control population" funny though that in NJ (Morris County area) they added 5 more parks that makes I think 15 park to kill deer plus they added Sundays and Deer Vehicle Accidents has gone up 54% in the past 5 years you'd think wow, deer vehicle accidents has gone donw a bit but NO, its gone up. DVA peaks during hunting season that is a fact plus with the abundance of deer that hunting industry deliberately produce for recreational killing and blood money for thmesleves. ...more
By Caroline Thompson (30), Sag harbor on Mar 15, 10 8:03 PM
google "food plot, supplment feeding, deer feeders" and you wonder why we have "too many deer". The bowhunters or in reality bowkillers, act like they are the "saviors" but they are only killing animals the industry created and they enjoy killing the animasl and causing them pain and suffering if they did not they would not be using a weapon as barbaric and innaccurate as a bow and arrow. Most deer end up left wounded and crippled which can take hours, even days to die. Its horrible ,
By Caroline Thompson (30), Sag harbor on Mar 15, 10 8:21 PM
There will be a video put together about East Hamptos NY, Sag harbor, and North haven, that loves to kill innocent sentient being and the people who support the killing but how dumb they are because the more youu kill the more deer you will end up having(just a vicious cyclce). Plus deer tick can plant themselves on white footed mouse, birds anything. Deer actually clean each other off of ticks I have watched them many times doing it.
By Caroline Thompson (30), Sag harbor on Mar 15, 10 8:47 PM
Did I forget to mention the killing of plants!? Because we do that too Caroline, ahh, but we don't know if they feel pain and thankfully we don't have the means to find out nor the ability to relate to what a plant's life means to the plant. And thank God for that because if we were able to find that they feel pain as well, what would that leave... rocks & dirt! But then we might find that they..........................................................................................I'm going ...more
By maggi (7), East Hampton on Mar 15, 10 10:05 PM
Oh there goes the "killing plant" absurdity because they ran out of BS, excuses and lies.
By Caroline Thompson (30), Sag harbor on Mar 16, 10 7:33 AM
This was an addendum to a post the first post I wrote, however the first post hasn't been posted yet and so they are out of order...
By maggi (7), East Hampton on Mar 15, 10 10:13 PM
"Mr. O’Riordan added that hunters had given more than 2,000 pounds of venison to the East Hampton food bank during hunting season this year."

Awww isn't that so "kind". After you kill the animals for fun, sports trophy or what ever your kicks are you "give" to the pantries. Easy to "give" what you don't want isn't it and these deer carcass is non-usda inspected. How about bovine TB, Parasites and worse is Prions from CWD. Are they checking those? In Pantries they ground up the meat ...more
By Caroline Thompson (30), Sag harbor on Mar 16, 10 7:56 AM
“I’m a vegetarian for moral and health reasons, but I am also a bow hunter,” said Deborah Klugers. “I don’t think it’s humane to let deer starve to death. In New York State we’ve done a great job of taking away predators.”

You are a "vegetarian" not a VEGAN. A Vegan would NEVER support killing of any animals and especially with the use of bow and arrow which is barbaric and the death is horrific as it is. It's funny how I always here the "I am a vegetarian but I support killing". ...more
By Caroline Thompson (30), Sag harbor on Mar 16, 10 9:12 AM
i love the deer , just do not tell me I cant fence my property, GET IT! good
By 27dan (2854), south hampton on Mar 16, 10 11:45 AM
The town of the rich and cruel if they see even baby deer eating near their yard (not in their yard either) they are allowed to get a nuisance deer license and kill them. One has to be a sadist human to want to kill babies because they want to have food to eat and they are not even in the yard (the neighbor got fences). Some of the old farts just hate animals. And don't give me that "we eat the deer" when their bodies are filled with pesticide sprayed on lawns. Plus look at the roads barely any ...more
By Caroline Thompson (30), Sag harbor on Mar 21, 10 6:46 AM
You no what's funny Caroline, I find most vegans and animal advocates like yourself are also far left lib's who are pro choice....Oh the hypocrisy
By 27dan (2854), south hampton on Mar 21, 10 12:00 PM